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ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction 12:25 - Mar 18 with 18162 viewsthemodfather

if mentioned elsewhere, sorry, brum reportedly facing a 12 pt deduction ( I missed the start of the report but think its ffp and signings related) ssn said it's not clear if any reduction is this season or next.
and Bolton must be close to admin, they seem to pay the players late, at best.
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ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 12:39 - Mar 18 with 6619 viewsCroydonCaptJack

That could be a result for us next season!

Shades of Faurlingate isn't it. You have to feel for the Brum fans not knowing if they are in a relegation scrap or not.
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ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 13:09 - Mar 18 with 6475 viewsRs_Holy

I'd love to know what Harry Candle Face has to say about this mess?
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ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 13:17 - Mar 18 with 6430 viewsJuzzie

ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 13:09 - Mar 18 by Rs_Holy

I'd love to know what Harry Candle Face has to say about this mess?


Not only would he not give a fk but he'll say it'll absolutely nothing to do win him.

He'd say he just asks for the players. The club then pay the fees and salaries. He doesn't even know what they earn, apparently.
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ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 13:39 - Mar 18 with 6315 viewsjohnhoop

ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 13:17 - Mar 18 by Juzzie

Not only would he not give a fk but he'll say it'll absolutely nothing to do win him.

He'd say he just asks for the players. The club then pay the fees and salaries. He doesn't even know what they earn, apparently.


Yeah but when we refused to open the cheque book for him in that January transfer window he walked ( or rather hobbled away on his supposedly dodgy knees). He’s been partially or wholly responsible for ruining three cubs, Portsmouth, us and now Birmingham. Yet tonight he’s the nation’s favourite football manager on TV, starring in some load of shite with an audience of millions.
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ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 14:09 - Mar 18 with 6189 viewsdaveB

ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 13:39 - Mar 18 by johnhoop

Yeah but when we refused to open the cheque book for him in that January transfer window he walked ( or rather hobbled away on his supposedly dodgy knees). He’s been partially or wholly responsible for ruining three cubs, Portsmouth, us and now Birmingham. Yet tonight he’s the nation’s favourite football manager on TV, starring in some load of shite with an audience of millions.


clubs could have always said no to letting him spend money the clubs didn't have. Spurs managed to do that
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ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 14:52 - Mar 18 with 6023 viewsJuzzie

ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 14:09 - Mar 18 by daveB

clubs could have always said no to letting him spend money the clubs didn't have. Spurs managed to do that


True, but clubs like Southampton, Portsmouth, QPR were all chasing to get to or stay in the promised land so they just spent in the hope of fulfilling that.

Spurs didn't have to as very well established already so Levy could stand his ground.


[Post edited 18 Mar 2019 14:53]
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ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 15:13 - Mar 18 with 5959 viewsphilc

ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 14:52 - Mar 18 by Juzzie

True, but clubs like Southampton, Portsmouth, QPR were all chasing to get to or stay in the promised land so they just spent in the hope of fulfilling that.

Spurs didn't have to as very well established already so Levy could stand his ground.


[Post edited 18 Mar 2019 14:53]


12 point deduction is a joke of a punishment. Birmingham arn’t going up and by the time it’s sanctioned they won’t be going down. Currently it’s the difference between finishing 13 and 19th what’s the point of that as a deterrent?
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ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 15:30 - Mar 18 with 5898 viewsdaveB

ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 14:52 - Mar 18 by Juzzie

True, but clubs like Southampton, Portsmouth, QPR were all chasing to get to or stay in the promised land so they just spent in the hope of fulfilling that.

Spurs didn't have to as very well established already so Levy could stand his ground.


[Post edited 18 Mar 2019 14:53]


I get they were very different clubs but the clubs let Redknapp spend like mad, we let Hughes do the same as well as did most managers from 2007-2015, Redknapp wasted a lot of money with us, he also made a few very good signings as well but ultimately it's down to the owners and the people running the club to balance the books, shouldn't be relying on a former footballer with very limited education to do that in a multi million pound business.
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ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 15:32 - Mar 18 with 5890 viewsdaveB

ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 15:13 - Mar 18 by philc

12 point deduction is a joke of a punishment. Birmingham arn’t going up and by the time it’s sanctioned they won’t be going down. Currently it’s the difference between finishing 13 and 19th what’s the point of that as a deterrent?


Well if you took 12 points off us now we'd be relegated so it should be a deterrent for most clubs
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ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 15:50 - Mar 18 with 5804 viewsCroydonCaptJack

ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 15:13 - Mar 18 by philc

12 point deduction is a joke of a punishment. Birmingham arn’t going up and by the time it’s sanctioned they won’t be going down. Currently it’s the difference between finishing 13 and 19th what’s the point of that as a deterrent?


As it stands that would pull seven teams directly into a relegation spot and another four into a bit of trouble.
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ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 15:54 - Mar 18 with 5786 viewsQPR_John

ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 15:32 - Mar 18 by daveB

Well if you took 12 points off us now we'd be relegated so it should be a deterrent for most clubs


Surely it has to be a deterrent for all clubs
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ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 15:56 - Mar 18 with 5773 viewsdaveB

ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 15:54 - Mar 18 by QPR_John

Surely it has to be a deterrent for all clubs


It should be, it's either going to relegate you or end your changes of getting promoted
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ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 16:04 - Mar 18 with 5744 viewsBostonR

What a mess the FL have made of it all. There has to be parity on penalties otherwise the whole thing will collapse.

I assume some very smart (or more likely stupid) FL lawyer is trying to make some headway on damage limitation on this. If I were on the QPR Board, I would have my finger on the telephone dial to our lawyers to raise our case if the Birmingham penalty is punitive.

As for the other clubs facing FFP sanctions, it will either sign "doom for next season" or "go for it".

Interesting times..
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ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 16:07 - Mar 18 with 5739 viewsCamberleyR

The punishment should be enforced at the start of a new season, it's pretty meaningless otherwise.

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ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 16:18 - Mar 18 with 5690 viewswombat

ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 16:07 - Mar 18 by CamberleyR

The punishment should be enforced at the start of a new season, it's pretty meaningless otherwise.


Not if they was to somehow get promotion this season its not , wouldn't then come into play until they was back down in the championship , fine then now

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ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 16:24 - Mar 18 with 5661 viewsWrightUp5hit___

Jars somewhat against a £20/£60 million fine.
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ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 16:54 - Mar 18 with 5565 viewsAntti_Heinola

ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 13:39 - Mar 18 by johnhoop

Yeah but when we refused to open the cheque book for him in that January transfer window he walked ( or rather hobbled away on his supposedly dodgy knees). He’s been partially or wholly responsible for ruining three cubs, Portsmouth, us and now Birmingham. Yet tonight he’s the nation’s favourite football manager on TV, starring in some load of shite with an audience of millions.


Dave and others can offer up a defence, but the fact is his record everywhere is terrible. Few know (or remember) that he almost terminated Bournemouth too. Then he did the same at West Ham. And Pompey. And us. And Birmingham. And he relegated Southampton. It cannot just be coincidence I'm afraid.

Bare bones.

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ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 17:01 - Mar 18 with 5531 viewsterryb

ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 15:13 - Mar 18 by philc

12 point deduction is a joke of a punishment. Birmingham arn’t going up and by the time it’s sanctioned they won’t be going down. Currently it’s the difference between finishing 13 and 19th what’s the point of that as a deterrent?


If a 12 point deduction is for this season, that would leave Brum two points above Rotherham.

I would say that would make them uncomfortably close to relegation! The game between them in April mighty be significant.

I don't see why any deduction couldn't be imposed by the time the next league matches are played & It could always be added back to their total points if an appeal was sucessful.
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ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 17:10 - Mar 18 with 5496 viewsdaveB

ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 16:54 - Mar 18 by Antti_Heinola

Dave and others can offer up a defence, but the fact is his record everywhere is terrible. Few know (or remember) that he almost terminated Bournemouth too. Then he did the same at West Ham. And Pompey. And us. And Birmingham. And he relegated Southampton. It cannot just be coincidence I'm afraid.


not really defending him just think clubs could easily have put in place a budget they could afford rather than giving him fortunes to bankrupt themselves, the similarity between all those clubs is they were really poorly run from the top
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ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 17:19 - Mar 18 with 5439 viewsNorthernr

ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 16:07 - Mar 18 by CamberleyR

The punishment should be enforced at the start of a new season, it's pretty meaningless otherwise.


One of the many fundamental problems with FFP is it is based on accounts, which run on a financial/tax year April-April basis and only have to be filed to Companies House several months after that, usually around this time of year. Whereas football seasons obviously run August-May.

This is a problem because, as we've seen with Wolves, Leicester, Bournemouth and ourselves (though we fcked it up) you can just deliberately ignore and break the rule, get promoted spending money you shouldn't have been allowed to spend, but it only comes to light when the accounts go in nine or ten months after the promotion is won by which time you're off and away into the Premier League and out of the jurisdiction of the EFL.

Birmingham are being punished for something they did getting on two managers and nearly two years ago now. And as said, this massive delay has meant they're now in a situation where the punishment makes no difference to them. The league has tried to close this time frame by making clubs put a pre-accounting statement in prior to the summer, but Birmingham and Sheff Wed both did that, were both in breach, and basically nothing happened - they got soft, secret, unannounced transfer embargoes, which Birmingham ignored anyway to sign Pedersen.

If one of the things FFP is meant to do is stop clubs spending beyond their means and getting into trouble, then in many ways it actually does the opposite. Because this tax year v football year inbalance encourages clubs to have a big gamble for it and try to get up before the punishment hits. We've seen that at Villa, Forest, Birmingham and elsewhere.
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ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 17:19 - Mar 18 with 5437 viewsterryb

ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 17:10 - Mar 18 by daveB

not really defending him just think clubs could easily have put in place a budget they could afford rather than giving him fortunes to bankrupt themselves, the similarity between all those clubs is they were really poorly run from the top


I wouldn't disagree with that Dave.

However, the problem was the club's appointing him in the first place. Once he is in position, you either spend the money or find a new manager.

He would never accept a lower budget!

I certainly wouldn't want it on my record that six of the seven clubs I managed had a (or near) financial breakdown after I left them!
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ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 17:21 - Mar 18 with 5426 viewsPunteR

ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 17:10 - Mar 18 by daveB

not really defending him just think clubs could easily have put in place a budget they could afford rather than giving him fortunes to bankrupt themselves, the similarity between all those clubs is they were really poorly run from the top


Cant really argue with that but shows Redknapps cynicism and general attitude towards football and football fans. He knows exactly how his style of management effects clubs.
Bloke is a con artist.

Occasional providers of half decent House music.

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ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 17:31 - Mar 18 with 5389 viewsted_hendrix

ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 16:54 - Mar 18 by Antti_Heinola

Dave and others can offer up a defence, but the fact is his record everywhere is terrible. Few know (or remember) that he almost terminated Bournemouth too. Then he did the same at West Ham. And Pompey. And us. And Birmingham. And he relegated Southampton. It cannot just be coincidence I'm afraid.


Excellent post and spot on the money (In a manner of speaking).

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ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 17:36 - Mar 18 with 5365 viewsdaveB

ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 17:19 - Mar 18 by terryb

I wouldn't disagree with that Dave.

However, the problem was the club's appointing him in the first place. Once he is in position, you either spend the money or find a new manager.

He would never accept a lower budget!

I certainly wouldn't want it on my record that six of the seven clubs I managed had a (or near) financial breakdown after I left them!


easy answer is don't employ him, when Hughes went no one would have been shocked that redknapp wanted to spend big money, could see it coming long before hughes was sacked he had his eye on us talking about us on MOTD and on the gold course. Problem we had was we had already spent a fortune with no relegation release clause so that was one last throw of the dice to avoid going down and a meltdown. Brilliantly we managed to make things worse.
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ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 18:02 - Mar 18 with 5282 viewsDejR_vu

ssn brum facing 12 pts deduction on 17:19 - Mar 18 by Northernr

One of the many fundamental problems with FFP is it is based on accounts, which run on a financial/tax year April-April basis and only have to be filed to Companies House several months after that, usually around this time of year. Whereas football seasons obviously run August-May.

This is a problem because, as we've seen with Wolves, Leicester, Bournemouth and ourselves (though we fcked it up) you can just deliberately ignore and break the rule, get promoted spending money you shouldn't have been allowed to spend, but it only comes to light when the accounts go in nine or ten months after the promotion is won by which time you're off and away into the Premier League and out of the jurisdiction of the EFL.

Birmingham are being punished for something they did getting on two managers and nearly two years ago now. And as said, this massive delay has meant they're now in a situation where the punishment makes no difference to them. The league has tried to close this time frame by making clubs put a pre-accounting statement in prior to the summer, but Birmingham and Sheff Wed both did that, were both in breach, and basically nothing happened - they got soft, secret, unannounced transfer embargoes, which Birmingham ignored anyway to sign Pedersen.

If one of the things FFP is meant to do is stop clubs spending beyond their means and getting into trouble, then in many ways it actually does the opposite. Because this tax year v football year inbalance encourages clubs to have a big gamble for it and try to get up before the punishment hits. We've seen that at Villa, Forest, Birmingham and elsewhere.


If they’re going to persist with this nonsense the points deduction should be applied in the season following the ruling, but if the club in question finishes the season sixth of above they are demoted to seventh (or lower if more than one club is penalised). That way it’s a real punishment and there’s no incentive to roll the dice.

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