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Warburton post-match interview 00:29 - Sep 25 with 6087 viewsstainrods_elbow

Just listened to it on the Offish and, I don't know about you, for me it really caps off a depressing evening's work.

'We had to play a different style of football tonight .' No, we didn't! We needed to mix up flair and fortitude, not turn into Wimbledon AFC with an inferiority complex. We chose to play a game we clearly can't play well, got deeper as the game got longer, made the wrong subs, gifted them a goal (again), and handed them the three points by snatching defeat from the unlikely jaws of victory.

Then Nick London, right on script - in a voice whose tone always sounds to me perfectly tuned to that of a man longing for excuses to fail even when he's saying he's not - makes sure he gets said excuses away 65 seconds in, by talking up the 'how significant is it?' angle on the Everton cup win. A more perfect specimen of the 'leading question' you couldn't hope to find, which Warbs bites on gratefully, mentioning de Wijs down with cramp and JoJo hitting the deck, even though (as he himself half-acknowledged) neither actually played on Tuesday! You seriously couldn't make it up! Get a grip, man, and stop treating us all like imbeciles!

If the players really are at 'an exhaustion stage' after two games in a week, then, after fewer than 10 games of the season, I can only say (and will continue to say) something is really wrong with the fitness programme at QPR. It just won't wash!

Essentially, by telling the fans that there are 'consequences' (the manager's word) for progressing to the heady heights of the last 16 of the Carabao Cup, it's not hard to see that he's aggressively managing down our expectations to provide mitigation for both the team's and coaching staff's continuing deficiencies as some kind of irreversible form of footballing fate. Personally, I feel even worse about that than tonight's game, on the principle that a fish rots from its head.

Some people may feel I'm over-reacting, and perhaps I am, but my underlying beef stands regardless. People either look up or down in life, and I think tonight the barely coded message to the fans from the manager is not to expect too much, and, worse, to definitely expect to suffer for actually trying in a cup competition.

As a final observation, I wonder how the surviving members of our 1966-67 squad would feel listening to our manager speak this evening, who managed to actually win the League Cup and, blow me down, the Div III championship to boot (46 games then as now, funnily enough), with a squad of 18, on shit pitches, and, supposedly, a much lower knowledge-base of physical training - though, it would appear, much more aspiration. If, anyone is able to wind back the clock, I'd love to know if Alex Stock was whining to the media in a similar vein about dampening down our hopes before the leaves were off the trees - he'd have killed, I'm sure, to be working under modern management conditions. Either way, the likes of Dave Clement and Mick Leach would, I'll wager, be shaking their ghostly heads!
[Post edited 25 Sep 0:38]

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Warburton post-match interview on 00:50 - Sep 25 with 3655 viewsNortholt_Rs

Massive over reaction fella…. Tonight is disappointing for sure but we have a team that has cost nowt to put together so does lack that bit of quality required to really impact the league. Conceding 2 goals plus per game is obviously our major problem at the moment….and it needs fixing fast.

You better give me the chance, I’ll cut you down with a glance
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Warburton post-match interview on 00:51 - Sep 25 with 3636 viewsNorthernr

Have a day off.
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Warburton post-match interview on 01:05 - Sep 25 with 3590 viewsBrianMcCarthy

To answer your question, yes - some will think you're over re-acting. I'd be one of them.

Tactics are subjective, but I would agree with Warburton that we had to play a different style tonight. His usual style has failed in the past against high-line and gegenpress, he addressed that and we were one up inside a minute.

I thought we did very well away from home against a talented team, did very well, but fell short, and the better team on the night won. No shame.

As for his comments on fitness, I think we know by now that he manages our players' fitness far better than most managers we've had of late. Our injury record is far better than most teams, and so is our fitness as we finish games stronger than most.

We've all suffered through some managers who've injured our players, and some who've played players when injured, and some who've done both.

In sports we try to steal an edge on our opponents, our present opponents, not on history.

We steal an edge where we can get one, a nick where a nick is possible. Of course we can play the same 11, twice a week, for the whole season. But the oppo won't, and they'll be fresher, and they'll win more than we will.

Also, I would think that our heroes like Clement, Leach and many others would have liked to be treated better than they were - many retired early, crippled, concussed and poorer than they should have been.

We lost a game tonight. That's all.

"The opposite of love, after all, is not hate, but indifference."
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Warburton post-match interview on 01:06 - Sep 25 with 3589 viewsstainrods_elbow

Warburton post-match interview on 00:51 - Sep 25 by Northernr

Have a day off.


I daren't - QPR are an obsession! But thanks for the caring advice!

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Warburton post-match interview on 01:13 - Sep 25 with 3564 viewsstainrods_elbow

The point about ex-players of years gone by, in some cases, retiring in poorer medical condition has some purchase, I'll concede. But, in the modern era, we appear to have gone to the other extreme, for all the reasons I've given.

I also don't overlook Bournemouth and WBA are likely to be there or thereabouts at the business end of the season, and we've gone close to getting 2, 4 or even 6 points from both. Perhaps I'll feel a bit different by then, and perhaps I won't.

'Over-reacting', though, is as subjective as tactics, and always raises the question as to whether one's critics are under-reacting in their pleas for 'perspective'. Reacting is what we fans do, for better or worse. It's also part of a dynamic of under-achievement or 'managing down expectations', which I don't like and will call out for that reason - for the sake of those who can understand the machinery involved and don't mistake being a supporter for being part of a cult.

If all that happened when we lost games was our losing games, 'nothing to see here', what would be the point of a message board like this at all? As a fan of 40+ years standing, I also see the cultural changes in the game and the changing attitudes they sponsor, which latter are as culturally contingent as anything else, even and especially for those smug sorts who like to think they're the 'realists'.
[Post edited 25 Sep 1:21]

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Warburton post-match interview on 01:18 - Sep 25 with 3534 viewsBrianMcCarthy

Warburton post-match interview on 01:13 - Sep 25 by stainrods_elbow

The point about ex-players of years gone by, in some cases, retiring in poorer medical condition has some purchase, I'll concede. But, in the modern era, we appear to have gone to the other extreme, for all the reasons I've given.

I also don't overlook Bournemouth and WBA are likely to be there or thereabouts at the business end of the season, and we've gone close to getting 2, 4 or even 6 points from both. Perhaps I'll feel a bit different by then, and perhaps I won't.

'Over-reacting', though, is as subjective as tactics, and always raises the question as to whether one's critics are under-reacting in their pleas for 'perspective'. Reacting is what we fans do, for better or worse. It's also part of a dynamic of under-achievement or 'managing down expectations', which I don't like and will call out for that reason - for the sake of those who can understand the machinery involved and don't mistake being a supporter for being part of a cult.

If all that happened when we lost games was our losing games, 'nothing to see here', what would be the point of a message board like this at all? As a fan of 40+ years standing, I also see the cultural changes in the game and the changing attitudes they sponsor, which latter are as culturally contingent as anything else, even and especially for those smug sorts who like to think they're the 'realists'.
[Post edited 25 Sep 1:21]


Sound.

"'Over-reacting', though, is as subjective as tactics, and always raises the question as to whether one's critics are under-reacting in their pleas for 'perspective'. Reacting is what we fans do, for better or worse."

I agree. It was you who asked us whether you might be over-reacting. I was just guessing.

"The opposite of love, after all, is not hate, but indifference."
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Warburton post-match interview on 01:21 - Sep 25 with 3532 viewsstrikerace

I agree with the stainrods 100%. If you are as good or better than them, then make them change to fit you. Why change to a style that weakens your side, how does that help you win? Sure if you are clearly worse then yes, do whatever you need to do to keep it close.
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Warburton post-match interview on 01:22 - Sep 25 with 3525 viewsstainrods_elbow

I didn't ask 'you' (either individually or the board as a whole) if I was over-reacting, Brian; I was decently self-reflective enough to mention that some might think I was. That doesn't mean they're right in my eyes, fairly obviously.
[Post edited 25 Sep 1:24]

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Warburton post-match interview on 01:28 - Sep 25 with 3489 viewsBrianMcCarthy

Warburton post-match interview on 01:22 - Sep 25 by stainrods_elbow

I didn't ask 'you' (either individually or the board as a whole) if I was over-reacting, Brian; I was decently self-reflective enough to mention that some might think I was. That doesn't mean they're right in my eyes, fairly obviously.
[Post edited 25 Sep 1:24]


Grand, so.

"The opposite of love, after all, is not hate, but indifference."
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Warburton post-match interview on 08:28 - Sep 25 with 3108 viewsHooping_Mad

The manager tried something a little different and it nearly worked.

A goalkeeping error and to my mind a striker drifting offside to frequently made the difference. Swopping Grey for Dykes may have been a better move.

Their subs were more effective than ours and turned the game.

Maybe not playing JoJo who as I said on other threads defiantly picked up that hamstring against Bristol and probably should have been rested or just a late sub.

These are the small thing that cost us, some say would at 1-1 away from home we didn't shut up shop as we should have but Warbs doesn't seem to like doing that. Great when it works but does it have to be questioned when it doesn't and he admits he was trying something different?

In truth we made too many mistakes in our game management and that is on Warbs this time. Also the ref was a bit shit.(edit)
[Post edited 25 Sep 8:51]

Chairman of the Junior Hoilett appreciation society

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Warburton post-match interview on 10:15 - Sep 25 with 2847 viewsBillericayR

I can see the points of view on all here.

But every interview I hear about the number of games, no chance to train, the demands are great, its Saturday, Tuesday, Saturday or we are at Middlesboro and then back at Hull.
This might and probably is true. But it is the same for every team.
But if you say it enough then as a player you can easily see this as an excuse and probably in a game when it is close you can easily think I am tired because of the number of games.
It depresses me when I keep hearing it in every interview.

I hear many players say they would prefer to play than train especially when winning.

If things are not going well the management should be trying to boost the confidence.
I do think that Warburton is correct when he says we do have a good team.

I watched a Big Match Revisited last week. Arsenal v Stoke. It was Easter 1975. Commentator mentioned Stoke drew yesterday and on Monday they were playing Liverpool. Pitches were mud heaps. But as mentioned probably did not help many in later life.
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Warburton post-match interview on 10:21 - Sep 25 with 2819 viewskernowhoop

Losing three league games in succession is not good, but those defeats were by fine margins. If we had been thrashed each time, there would be more to discuss. It's disappointing, but MW's final comment - about learning from that match - is key. Despite this year's improvement, we do not have a squad which is good enough for automatic promotion. But, it is still good enough for a play-off place and there is still time to achieve that.
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Warburton post-match interview on 10:26 - Sep 25 with 2789 viewsBrianMcCarthy

Warburton post-match interview on 10:15 - Sep 25 by BillericayR

I can see the points of view on all here.

But every interview I hear about the number of games, no chance to train, the demands are great, its Saturday, Tuesday, Saturday or we are at Middlesboro and then back at Hull.
This might and probably is true. But it is the same for every team.
But if you say it enough then as a player you can easily see this as an excuse and probably in a game when it is close you can easily think I am tired because of the number of games.
It depresses me when I keep hearing it in every interview.

I hear many players say they would prefer to play than train especially when winning.

If things are not going well the management should be trying to boost the confidence.
I do think that Warburton is correct when he says we do have a good team.

I watched a Big Match Revisited last week. Arsenal v Stoke. It was Easter 1975. Commentator mentioned Stoke drew yesterday and on Monday they were playing Liverpool. Pitches were mud heaps. But as mentioned probably did not help many in later life.


"But if you say it enough then as a player you can easily see this as an excuse and probably in a game when it is close you can easily think I am tired because of the number of games."

Been thinking about this thread this morning, and I think this point is valid and you've nailed it in your post.

"The opposite of love, after all, is not hate, but indifference."
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Warburton post-match interview on 10:33 - Sep 25 with 2756 viewsfrancisbowles

Warburton post-match interview on 10:26 - Sep 25 by BrianMcCarthy

"But if you say it enough then as a player you can easily see this as an excuse and probably in a game when it is close you can easily think I am tired because of the number of games."

Been thinking about this thread this morning, and I think this point is valid and you've nailed it in your post.


It's a valid point but my eyes were telling me that Dickie, Dunne, Chair and Ball were all really fatigued in the later stages which affects the teams' energy levels and leads to individual mistakes. Gray also shattered but I think that was more down to lack of match fitness.
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Warburton post-match interview on 10:49 - Sep 25 with 2717 viewsGloryHunter

Warbs' moaning about the number of games is not going to change anything. There will never be fewer games. But psychologically it might give some players an excuse to perform less well. I've been saying this ever since his big rant about only having a few weeks notice of the resumption after lockdown. I really wish he'd shut up about it. It's not having any kind of positive effect.
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Warburton post-match interview on 11:00 - Sep 25 with 2686 viewsStanisgod

Warburton post-match interview on 01:21 - Sep 25 by strikerace

I agree with the stainrods 100%. If you are as good or better than them, then make them change to fit you. Why change to a style that weakens your side, how does that help you win? Sure if you are clearly worse then yes, do whatever you need to do to keep it close.


Exactly, as Cloughie used to say, let the other team worry about US.

It's being so happy that keeps me going.

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Warburton post-match interview on 11:06 - Sep 25 with 2655 viewsted_hendrix

Haven't heard the post match interview cos I'm not interested.

The only thing on my mind this morning is consistency which we seem to be good at having lost three league games on the trot 2-1.

Anybody who's anybody can waffle all day long about losing and all the bullshit reasons but we're good at the moment at being consistent with our current results, in fact if there was a consistency league we'd be top of it.

Consistent.

My Father had a profound influence on me, he was a lunatic.

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Warburton post-match interview on 11:51 - Sep 25 with 2550 viewsQPROslo

Warburton post-match interview on 08:28 - Sep 25 by Hooping_Mad

The manager tried something a little different and it nearly worked.

A goalkeeping error and to my mind a striker drifting offside to frequently made the difference. Swopping Grey for Dykes may have been a better move.

Their subs were more effective than ours and turned the game.

Maybe not playing JoJo who as I said on other threads defiantly picked up that hamstring against Bristol and probably should have been rested or just a late sub.

These are the small thing that cost us, some say would at 1-1 away from home we didn't shut up shop as we should have but Warbs doesn't seem to like doing that. Great when it works but does it have to be questioned when it doesn't and he admits he was trying something different?

In truth we made too many mistakes in our game management and that is on Warbs this time. Also the ref was a bit shit.(edit)
[Post edited 25 Sep 8:51]


Hamstring? Stefan said twice interviewed after Bristol that he was perfectly ok.
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Warburton post-match interview on 11:57 - Sep 25 with 2519 viewsLongsufferingR

Quite simply, had Dieng not made the error, the commentators would have carried on saying how clever our change of tactics was, and they would have been right.
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Warburton post-match interview on 13:20 - Sep 25 with 2376 viewsHooping_Mad

Warburton post-match interview on 11:51 - Sep 25 by QPROslo

Hamstring? Stefan said twice interviewed after Bristol that he was perfectly ok.


He was limping and holding it for a good long while, didn't look good.

Wouldn't be surprised if he tried to play through it, seems the type.

Chairman of the Junior Hoilett appreciation society

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Warburton post-match interview on 13:53 - Sep 25 with 2304 viewsPinnerPaul

My beef is one I've aired before - I was fed up a long time ago with the fatigue argument.

As SE said JoJo and Di Wijis didn't play v Everton, MW also mentioned McCullum's injury in the same vein - he hasn't had many minutes and neither has Jimmy Dunne.

Gray also not involved v Everton.

As for other teams - well coming up we have Birmingham - playing today, we played yesterday and they have the travel obviously and then Nottm Forest - we play Tues AT HOME, they play WEDS at BARNSLEY, and of course as the away side , surprise, surprise they actually have to travel to us!

Its a nonsense to KEEP banging on and on about the fixtures.
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Warburton post-match interview on 13:54 - Sep 25 with 2300 viewsPinnerPaul

Warburton post-match interview on 10:33 - Sep 25 by francisbowles

It's a valid point but my eyes were telling me that Dickie, Dunne, Chair and Ball were all really fatigued in the later stages which affects the teams' energy levels and leads to individual mistakes. Gray also shattered but I think that was more down to lack of match fitness.


Gary didn't play v Everton and Dunne has hardly played all season.
[Post edited 25 Sep 13:56]
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Warburton post-match interview on 14:12 - Sep 25 with 2268 viewsstainrods_elbow

Good to see my post about his interview stimulated a lot of comment, and, surprisingly to me, a fair amount of agreement, so glad I didn't take the 'day off' that Clive thoughtfully suggested, as presumably provoking such conversations is the sine qua non and lovely lifeblood of a message board like this.

These post-match interviews are important as they are a big part of the face the club shows to the fanbase and, implicitly, evoke the affective image in which the team is being shaped. At times, however, Warbs resorts to cliches, which is likely to undermine the poetry of the team, and makes compulsive excuses, e.g. the fixture list, which suggests to me the coach may well himself be being coached from within the club to manage down expectations in the way that Ian Taylor once cynically extolled to me. I don't think that's so far-fetched. The sub-text of what he said post-West Brom was, 'we've given you a fabulous night vs Everton, so you need to accept the comedown vs the Baggies, because the players are human and that's what happens. Sorry, but suck it up!' Well, sorry, I'm not your Dyson, Mark!

Having an interviewer other than Nick London who had the balls to say, for example, 'sorry, gaffer, but de Wijs, Jojo and Gray didn't actually play against Everton, so how can they be tired?' would be a refreshing change, but I guess it wouldn't suit the QPR propaganda machine. The players are getting fantastic support, and the support deserves better.

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Warburton post-match interview on 14:20 - Sep 25 with 2248 viewsPinnerPaul

Warburton post-match interview on 14:12 - Sep 25 by stainrods_elbow

Good to see my post about his interview stimulated a lot of comment, and, surprisingly to me, a fair amount of agreement, so glad I didn't take the 'day off' that Clive thoughtfully suggested, as presumably provoking such conversations is the sine qua non and lovely lifeblood of a message board like this.

These post-match interviews are important as they are a big part of the face the club shows to the fanbase and, implicitly, evoke the affective image in which the team is being shaped. At times, however, Warbs resorts to cliches, which is likely to undermine the poetry of the team, and makes compulsive excuses, e.g. the fixture list, which suggests to me the coach may well himself be being coached from within the club to manage down expectations in the way that Ian Taylor once cynically extolled to me. I don't think that's so far-fetched. The sub-text of what he said post-West Brom was, 'we've given you a fabulous night vs Everton, so you need to accept the comedown vs the Baggies, because the players are human and that's what happens. Sorry, but suck it up!' Well, sorry, I'm not your Dyson, Mark!

Having an interviewer other than Nick London who had the balls to say, for example, 'sorry, gaffer, but de Wijs, Jojo and Gray didn't actually play against Everton, so how can they be tired?' would be a refreshing change, but I guess it wouldn't suit the QPR propaganda machine. The players are getting fantastic support, and the support deserves better.


Agree with most of that, but like so many things we claim to be unique to us, 'friendly in house' interviews are certainly not and are the norm in football these days.
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Warburton post-match interview on 14:30 - Sep 25 with 2227 viewsstainrods_elbow

Warburton post-match interview on 14:20 - Sep 25 by PinnerPaul

Agree with most of that, but like so many things we claim to be unique to us, 'friendly in house' interviews are certainly not and are the norm in football these days.


Sadly so, but real (fan) love often requires a kind of passionate antagonism to get at the truth. We're part of a football club - a raging church like the blue and white sea itself, not a feckin' loved-up, pre-programmed cult.

Aren't we?
[Post edited 25 Sep 14:39]

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