| Met Police on 22:17 - Mar 21 with 1835 views | wombat |
| Met Police on 16:04 - Mar 21 by Esox_Lucius |
Tangentially; some of you may know PC John Gerrard, I was told at the Brum game that he is very sick and we may not see him again. He is definitely one of the good guys in uniform and this is sad news. Get well soon John. |
Heard the same thing at the hull game , very sad and a nice guy who’s has stopped a few of our lot in recent years getting into serious trouble by having an old fashioned word in there ears before things got stupid , very nice guy who loved his job and the `Rs |  |
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| Met Police on 09:30 - Mar 22 with 1651 views | PlanetHonneywood |
| Met Police on 14:42 - Mar 21 by The_Beast1976 |
"The problem then, as it appears now, is a white boys' culture....."
What on earth is a "white boys' cuiture"? That statement in itself is potentially as deeply racist and offensive as anything that the Met has been accused of. [Post edited 21 Mar 2023 14:43]
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As I said, I had a couple of years experience to base my suspicions on, and as we have seen from the many situations where officers accused/found guilty are...wait for it...white males, then I’m sure you can work it out.
The current report again restates the presence of a ‘boys club’ culture, just that I’ve not seen/aware that the predominant sources of these misogynistic, racist or homophobic acts are anything other than...
But I also repeat: thank God we have police and I don’t envy their job. But they do make it harder for themselves and it starts with poor recruitment, training and management. This is the police whose primary role is to arrest and apprehend criminals, so we should expect them to be able to stop it within their own ranks so as the bad apples don’t taint the barrel. |  |
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| Met Police on 15:46 - Mar 22 with 1502 views | nix |
| Met Police on 15:03 - Mar 21 by ed_83 |
Agree with lots of this - plenty of people within the Met are hardworking and ethically sound - but past a certain point you have to look beyond the "bad apples" and ask why the surrounding structure and culture allows stuff like this to keep happening.
The Met have lost the trust of huge numbers of Londoners not just because individual officers have done terrible things, but because so many of their colleagues keep letting them get away with it.
Look at something like the killing of Jean Charles de Menezes - Cressida Dick presides over an absolute clusterfck that ends up with the death of an innocent man, and she ends up running the whole force a few years later. Or the murder of Daniel Morgan, where the police took 8 years to provide all the relevant documents to the victim's family and the inquiry into his killing. Or all the in-jokes about "Bstard Dave" - loads of banter, nobody willing or able to actually pull the alarm. 1,000+ Met officers and staff have been accused of domestic violence or sexual crimes, but haven't been suspended.
That's not a problem of a few individual people being scumbags, it's a fundamentally broken system: an entire institution which protects the bad people within it, and prevents the good ones from changing things, or even just doing their jobs properly.
The new commissioner's out doing media rounds today asking for more powers to fire dodgy coppers, which misses the point. Until they recognise this is an institutional problem, and commit to a properly fundamental rethinking of how things work, nothing is going to change. |
I agree with all of this.
It is not the level of bad apples in the police force, it's the reflex action in covering up the transgressions of those within the organisation. If someone knows there will be consequences, they are less likely to commit offences.
Cressida Dick was a disaster. She was a natural politician, there to massage figures, spin news stories and divert attention from cock ups. She didn't see reform or improvement as her focus. It was obvious from every mealy mouthed statement that came from her mouth.
The events surrounding the Daniel Morgan and Stephen Lawrence investigations went way beyond incompetence, surely to corruption.
It's early days with Rowley but he does seem to show greater willingness to face issues head on. However, it was disappointing that he wouldn't accept the term institutional. It surely is an institutional issue.
My concern is not what goes wrong in individual incidents, it's where people keep their jobs in spite of their behaviour., and with those whose instinct is to cover up rather than examine and provide redress. |  | | |
| Met Police on 16:25 - Mar 22 with 1463 views | Northernr |
One thing they could do is learn the full "bad apples" phrase/metaphor. It's not the defence they seem to think it is. |  | | |
| Met Police on 19:20 - Mar 22 with 1381 views | Boston |
| Met Police on 22:17 - Mar 21 by wombat |
Heard the same thing at the hull game , very sad and a nice guy who’s has stopped a few of our lot in recent years getting into serious trouble by having an old fashioned word in there ears before things got stupid , very nice guy who loved his job and the `Rs |
Would that be the gent who sat in the Paddocks for forever? |  |
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| Met Police on 19:20 - Mar 22 with 1380 views | PlanetHonneywood |
| Met Police on 16:25 - Mar 22 by Northernr |
One thing they could do is learn the full "bad apples" phrase/metaphor. It's not the defence they seem to think it is. |
They were going to use the ‘tarred brush’ idiom up until Monday night, but then when they actually saw a tarred brush, they got cold feet. | |
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| Met Police on 21:27 - Mar 22 with 1308 views | colinallcars |
| Met Police on 19:20 - Mar 22 by PlanetHonneywood |
They were going to use the ‘tarred brush’ idiom up until Monday night, but then when they actually saw a tarred brush, they got cold feet. |
That Jimmy Tarbrush was a good comedian. |  | | |
| Met Police on 22:30 - Mar 22 with 1270 views | Beckenhamhoop |
| Met Police on 14:52 - Mar 21 by LazyFan |
"institutionally racist, institutionally misogynistic and institutionally homophobic" you say?
"institutionally" does not mean the majority, but it means way more than a small minority. It really means, in tangible terms a large minority at all levels of the operational hierarchy.
But that's not the problem, the real problem for the Met is Racism, as this a crime on the statute books (as it should be) and saying that there is a large number of criminals at all levels in the Met, means the Met would be deemed as a criminal organisation.
As it's also the police, this means that the Met would and should probably have to arrest around 30% of their own coppers, to break up this criminal organisation, as they would do this with any other criminal organisation even if the majority was not of criminal intent.
This is why you will always hear the head copper say something like, "well when you say institutionally, I am not sure it's meant in the same way as you think". There is always some lame excuse to avoid this word as; otherwise, they will indeed be required to start arresting each other!!!
So, it's not a wokey, snowflaky type thingy, it's avoiding arresting each other is what the head copper is often trying weasel out of. But actually, that may well be what's needed. We have tried all the lamo management-style ways of fobbing off this off.
To end the cycle of no change, it may well require coppers to arrest coppers and lots of them.
To help here, one approach they could do is link this to the stop & search policy, which often targets a higher percentage of non-white people to the number of random stop & searchers of police officers. Yes, that's right, they get stopped and searched at the same level. Fairs fair, no excuess!
So, it could go down like "I am sorry sir but you are known to be part of the same criminal organisation as me. Therefore I am required to stop & search you sir", with the victim's usual reply of "you cannot do that I know my rights ... errr as I am a copper too", resulting in the usually scripted comeback of "I am afraid we have to treat everyone equally and I have got stats to hit so, your being searched, ensure you don't resist as you know what will happen" <<< added threat for the last part as that's standard Met policing.
Now, if we do this, the public will see its fair, bent coppers will more likely get caught (no guarantees but it ups the chances) and the innocent coppers of course, "have nothing to fear if you have nothing to hide" as we are so often told. Remember no excuses!
The only problem here will be whinging woke right whingers, with their snowflake ways crying that the police should not be subject to the same laws of the land with their lamo cry baby excuses.
But if you really want to protect the innocent coppers, who will ARE the majority (which I can prove if you need it), then iff the police are forced to do this (legally required), I think you will find a higher backing for them and we should all be backing the good police over the bad. This would show results by ensuring the good police are empowered to arrest the bad ones. And prove this by doing so relentlessly.
After all, my message to the right is "if you cannot do the police time, then don't do the police crime!" |
By far the most bonkers thing I’ve ever read on this forum. 🤪🤪 | | | |
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| Met Police on 23:00 - Mar 22 with 1225 views | BrianMcCarthy |
https://www.waterstones.com/bo
This is a fine book, which in the last year has helped bring focus on The Met, written by Rangers fan and Barrister, Harriet Johnson. |  |
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| Met Police on 23:05 - Mar 22 with 1206 views | Northernr |
Occasionally to be found in the Crown and Sceptre with fairly brilliant QPR dad Bill Johnson  | | | |
| Met Police on 00:10 - Mar 23 with 1140 views | CLAREMAN1995 |
| Met Police on 15:49 - Mar 21 by Boston |
Most police in the Greater Boston area have a degree in what they call 'Criminal Justice', that or they've served in the Marines. They then have to attend the Police Acadamy. Very few young coppers around my way. |
Huge difference in the US from England is the amount of guns on the streets and the gangs total disregard for human life.Young,old,man,woman cop it makes no difference to the thugs and sometimes they even have more lethal firepower than cops.
Plus the standards are being lowered to actually become a cop and you get a Memphis situation where there is no supervision or senior officer to step in .
As you say Boston a lot of ex military becoming cops but some have been acused of blood lust and emptying the magazine like its a shootout with the Taliban.
I have no idea what punishment is handed down in London but every city in America with horrific murder rates have soft on crime DAs which allow voilent crininals back out basically to repeat time after time.
Its pretty ironic to me that you have protestors demanding defund the police and accusing them of blanket racism yet when they are called the police respond without fear of their life time after time |  | | |
| Met Police on 00:26 - Mar 23 with 1136 views | kensalriser |
| Met Police on 00:10 - Mar 23 by CLAREMAN1995 |
Huge difference in the US from England is the amount of guns on the streets and the gangs total disregard for human life.Young,old,man,woman cop it makes no difference to the thugs and sometimes they even have more lethal firepower than cops.
Plus the standards are being lowered to actually become a cop and you get a Memphis situation where there is no supervision or senior officer to step in .
As you say Boston a lot of ex military becoming cops but some have been acused of blood lust and emptying the magazine like its a shootout with the Taliban.
I have no idea what punishment is handed down in London but every city in America with horrific murder rates have soft on crime DAs which allow voilent crininals back out basically to repeat time after time.
Its pretty ironic to me that you have protestors demanding defund the police and accusing them of blanket racism yet when they are called the police respond without fear of their life time after time |
You should watch the series Philly DA, it might open your eyes. |  |
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| Met Police on 00:34 - Mar 23 with 1129 views | Boston |
| Met Police on 00:26 - Mar 23 by kensalriser |
You should watch the series Philly DA, it might open your eyes. |
If you want your eyes opened, I'd walk the streets of Philly. | |
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| Met Police on 01:29 - Mar 23 with 1096 views | numptydumpty |
| Met Police on 16:50 - Mar 21 by francisbowles |
Very good post, especially the point about mental health. It shouldn't be the job of the police. |
No one wants to work in mental health roles currently and those that do, large percentage that don't last long.
Friends with a local police lady and mental health call outs are great majority of their jobs and during lock down she reckoned percentage was around 80%.
Police are trained to treat.criminals and so totally unprepared to deal with mental health cases so if you retrain police then you need make working in mental health much more enticing to Jo Bloggs which currently it is not at all. And first and foremost Police are trained to be aggressive to disarm aggression within the people they face.
Chicken and Egg scenarios !!! [Post edited 23 Mar 2023 1:52]
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