| The Welsh Assembly (Government) 21:47 - Aug 6 with 7699 views | keeponrockin |
How do they get away with it?
Genuinely?
Their record is absolutely appalling yet what happens? The same people are voted in and all they ever argue about is MORE powers.
Education/Health are an absolute shambles - they Centralise everything in Cardiff and we tumble in every ranking.
At least with the Scottish Gov there is some level of talent & competence. Yet nothing changes, the next election will no doubt see the same old glorified councillors running huge departments and simply hopping from one role to another.
They miss targets in pretty much every area, what do they do? Try to reform and sort things out? No they either scrap the target completely or change the target.
It's a bloody outrage but we seem to just accept second rate. I don't get this Country at times. |  | | |  |
| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 20:02 - Aug 7 with 1517 views | skippyjack |
| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 19:39 - Aug 7 by trampie |
Police, teachers, lecturers and some civil servants are overpaid and should be taxed accordingly [and not forgetting doctors are overpaid as well] . [Post edited 7 Aug 2014 19:41]
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That's not what they say.. in between 35k and 200k a year.. they class themselves over worked and under paid in their 300k (paid for) property..20k Audi' s...the properties they own + investments say otherwise..but they're probably right if they're comparing them to a celebrity... if anyone is under paid.. it's the under £10 an hour workers with mortgages.. |  |
| The awkward moment when a Welsh Club become the Champions of England.. shh
The Swansea Way.. To upset the odds. | | Poll: | Best Swans Player |
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| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 20:06 - Aug 7 with 1508 views | Pacemaker |
| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 19:39 - Aug 7 by trampie |
Police, teachers, lecturers and some civil servants are overpaid and should be taxed accordingly [and not forgetting doctors are overpaid as well] . [Post edited 7 Aug 2014 19:41]
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Do you think nurses are overpaid as well? |  |
| Life is an adventure or nothing at all. |
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| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 20:07 - Aug 7 with 1507 views | trampie |
| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 19:43 - Aug 7 by exiledclaseboy |
What do you consider to be "overpaid", trampie? And what rate of income tax would you levy on someone earning, say, £35k per year? |
Well its the whole package isn't it [pensions, holidays, working conditions, time off, pay etc].
Some people in the jobs mentioned are/were retiring at 48 years of age on two thirds their salary as a pension for life, some other jobs mentioned have marvellous holidays, no Christmas working, no weekends, no shiftwork, dry and warm conditions, one of the jobs mentioned they earn £100,000 plus [double even] and their pensions are worth millions.
When comparing jobs like the poster did that I replied to, some jobs are market value jobs like actors and the like but most police, teachers, doctors etc jobs are reimbursed by our taxes and giving them a good deal means less money in the pot for elsewhere.
I would prefer higher earners to pay more tax but if somebody said we all pay the same tax i'm ok with that, low earners would probably have to be paid more and high earners less for that to work but i'm ok with it. |  |
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| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 20:10 - Aug 7 with 1503 views | exiledclaseboy |
| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 20:07 - Aug 7 by trampie |
Well its the whole package isn't it [pensions, holidays, working conditions, time off, pay etc].
Some people in the jobs mentioned are/were retiring at 48 years of age on two thirds their salary as a pension for life, some other jobs mentioned have marvellous holidays, no Christmas working, no weekends, no shiftwork, dry and warm conditions, one of the jobs mentioned they earn £100,000 plus [double even] and their pensions are worth millions.
When comparing jobs like the poster did that I replied to, some jobs are market value jobs like actors and the like but most police, teachers, doctors etc jobs are reimbursed by our taxes and giving them a good deal means less money in the pot for elsewhere.
I would prefer higher earners to pay more tax but if somebody said we all pay the same tax i'm ok with that, low earners would probably have to be paid more and high earners less for that to work but i'm ok with it. |
Thanks. Fancy answering the questions I asked now? |  |
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| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 20:11 - Aug 7 with 1502 views | skippyjack |
| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 19:51 - Aug 7 by waynekerr55 |
Wow - just wow!
Tell that to them in the South East where they can't buy homes and instead pay ridiculous rents! |
What?.. you mean these well educated types can't foresight.. like buy cheaper houses and rent them out to gain extra funds?... move away from London to gain experience with cheaper housing?.. give me 35k a year and unlimited holidays.. I wouldn't moan.. I'd invest. | |
| The awkward moment when a Welsh Club become the Champions of England.. shh
The Swansea Way.. To upset the odds. | | Poll: | Best Swans Player |
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| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 20:14 - Aug 7 with 1499 views | LeonisGod |
| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 18:41 - Aug 7 by reddythered |
The Newport relief road is hardly just to benefit Cardiff... it's an absolute nightmare driving around that area. If you're a business, with the traffic snarl ups would you consider relocating to Cardiff, Bridgend, Swansea?
Education and health are appalling - but don't claim it's so Cardiff can benefit. My youngest has development problems - age 4, more like a 2 year old. Originally believed to be autism, now seems it's development delays. His head measurement is pretty low on the percentile chart, meaning the brain isn't growing neessarily as it should.
This problem could well have been spotted earlier but for doctors, health visitors failing to bother either taking the measurement or writing it down.
His school? At primary level can't expect great things - he goes to a dedicated school in September - but his one to one helper? A 19 yr old. About to go to Uni caused us great entertainment, given she couldn't spell for s***.
Hospitals? I could list the problems we've encountered as a family, my elderly dad, myself and my wife who suffers from a long term medical illness, sadly not curable. There wouldn't be enough time for everyone to read all the f*** ups made.
It's like anything else - yes, the WAG is absolutely garbage, performing as anyone with a brain cell could predict given the Labour dominance ( and the quality of politician in Wales these days ), but there's incompetence at all levels of the public sector. |
Health is slipping for sure. We noticed a big difference between the availability and quality of care during the delivery of our little uns (6 and 3).
But I'd stick up for education (some of it). The quality of education in some of the Welsh first language schools in Swansea and west wales is up there with the best in the UK. They are frequently up at or near the top of the league tables. |  | | |
| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 20:19 - Aug 7 with 1482 views | skippyjack |
Wouldn't that money be better invested in community projects.. like an institution for autistic people.. like that poor claire.. do you agree ECB? | |
| The awkward moment when a Welsh Club become the Champions of England.. shh
The Swansea Way.. To upset the odds. | | Poll: | Best Swans Player |
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| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 20:21 - Aug 7 with 1480 views | exiledclaseboy |
| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 20:19 - Aug 7 by skippyjack |
Wouldn't that money be better invested in community projects.. like an institution for autistic people.. like that poor claire.. do you agree ECB? |
Not sure why you're asking me but, yes. I completely agree with you. | |
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| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 20:25 - Aug 7 with 1474 views | Pacemaker |
| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 20:07 - Aug 7 by trampie |
Well its the whole package isn't it [pensions, holidays, working conditions, time off, pay etc].
Some people in the jobs mentioned are/were retiring at 48 years of age on two thirds their salary as a pension for life, some other jobs mentioned have marvellous holidays, no Christmas working, no weekends, no shiftwork, dry and warm conditions, one of the jobs mentioned they earn £100,000 plus [double even] and their pensions are worth millions.
When comparing jobs like the poster did that I replied to, some jobs are market value jobs like actors and the like but most police, teachers, doctors etc jobs are reimbursed by our taxes and giving them a good deal means less money in the pot for elsewhere.
I would prefer higher earners to pay more tax but if somebody said we all pay the same tax i'm ok with that, low earners would probably have to be paid more and high earners less for that to work but i'm ok with it. |
Totally stereotyping Trampie
Let's assume you joined the police today as a starter you would be paid 19k a year, have to work shifts all year around including Xmas family events etc, the shifts would be 7-7 nights and days continue work until at least 60 and pay a pension contribution of 13.5%.
You would have 22 days a year annual leave rising to 28 days after 20 years but the management decide when you can have those or not if the Olympics, NATO summit and other large events occur.
If you then decide to carry this on for 22 years you would get about 36k a year. Good pay for around here but not much if you live in the SouthEast of England.
Just read it all here
http://www.policeoracle.com/pay_and_conditions/police_pay_scales.html
What the Labour led assembly are doing in this country is a disgrace, public services are being stripped and people are losing their jobs. Meanwhile vanity projects like free bus passes, free parking at hospitals, free swimming pool entrance and now the Billion pound bypass when there was a much cheaper and greener route available is beyond belief. As someone who has always leaned to the left politically it is a disgrace that job cuts are taking place all over Wales and services are being cut by "the workers party of "Wales".
The amount of waste that takes place I that building is a disgrace when local authorities are having to sack good hard working people. | |
| Life is an adventure or nothing at all. |
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| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 20:28 - Aug 7 with 1470 views | trampie |
| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 20:10 - Aug 7 by exiledclaseboy |
Thanks. Fancy answering the questions I asked now? |
No issue with the current banding for £35k a year but the rate for £150k is too low. | |
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| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 20:31 - Aug 7 with 1467 views | skippyjack |
| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 20:21 - Aug 7 by exiledclaseboy |
Not sure why you're asking me but, yes. I completely agree with you. |
Shouldn't you strike against this.. and put in a few not very nice complaints.. are they serving this up the LA. | |
| The awkward moment when a Welsh Club become the Champions of England.. shh
The Swansea Way.. To upset the odds. | | Poll: | Best Swans Player |
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| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 20:34 - Aug 7 with 1457 views | waynekerr55 |
| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 20:11 - Aug 7 by skippyjack |
What?.. you mean these well educated types can't foresight.. like buy cheaper houses and rent them out to gain extra funds?... move away from London to gain experience with cheaper housing?.. give me 35k a year and unlimited holidays.. I wouldn't moan.. I'd invest. |
Two points to make:
1 - teachers don't get paid 35k until around 10 years service or if they get promoted (rightly or wrongly but that's another debate altogether  )
2 - There aren't any cheaper houses - Me and Mrs WK live in Watford as she works in Luton and I'm by Harrow. We are in the process of acquiring the freehold so that our flat is mortgageable. This time last year we would have got a 2 bed house for around 250k now there's nothing under 320k. Renting isn't really an option as the rent is higher than what we'd pay on a mortgage. It's not as simple as that
(PS - there are no jobs in Swansea or the surrounding area or we'd be back. Such is life!) |  |
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| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 20:39 - Aug 7 with 1440 views | exiledclaseboy |
| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 20:31 - Aug 7 by skippyjack |
Shouldn't you strike against this.. and put in a few not very nice complaints.. are they serving this up the LA. |
I have no idea what you're talking about. I'm not in a trade union, I don't work for the Welsh civil service and I haven't eaten a meal in the canteen where I work for at least a decade. I buy two slices of toast there every morning at 25p a slice. That works out at about £3 a loaf so I doubt anyone's subsidising that. Our canteen is contracted out to a private firm who I'd imagine are turning a whacking great profit on it too, given the amount of people who do eat there.
So I've still no idea why you're asking me. | |
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| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 20:40 - Aug 7 with 1439 views | exiledclaseboy |
| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 20:28 - Aug 7 by trampie |
No issue with the current banding for £35k a year but the rate for £150k is too low. |
Fair enough. Don't disagree. | |
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| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 20:44 - Aug 7 with 1390 views | trampie |
| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 20:06 - Aug 7 by Pacemaker |
Do you think nurses are overpaid as well? |
No I don't think they are overpaid. | |
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| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 21:04 - Aug 7 with 1371 views | skippyjack |
| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 20:34 - Aug 7 by waynekerr55 |
Two points to make:
1 - teachers don't get paid 35k until around 10 years service or if they get promoted (rightly or wrongly but that's another debate altogether )
2 - There aren't any cheaper houses - Me and Mrs WK live in Watford as she works in Luton and I'm by Harrow. We are in the process of acquiring the freehold so that our flat is mortgageable. This time last year we would have got a 2 bed house for around 250k now there's nothing under 320k. Renting isn't really an option as the rent is higher than what we'd pay on a mortgage. It's not as simple as that
(PS - there are no jobs in Swansea or the surrounding area or we'd be back. Such is life!) |
It'll increase with experience..
Surely.. something cheaper on the outskirts..
I'm not talking about Swansea.. I'm presuming you're both youngish.. Earn 50k between you?.. and you're complaining. | |
| The awkward moment when a Welsh Club become the Champions of England.. shh
The Swansea Way.. To upset the odds. | | Poll: | Best Swans Player |
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| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 21:17 - Aug 7 with 1357 views | Pacemaker |
| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 20:44 - Aug 7 by trampie |
No I don't think they are overpaid. |
Nurses get 21k starting as a registered Nurse to £41k and then on and on promotion to band 8-9 which covers £40k -98k
The WAG is cutting Billions from the Local Govt budget but has decided to bring in a guaranteed living wage for NHS staff, this is laudable but how can you agree to this for the NHS which is already overspending it's budget when making local govt cut it's budget and sack people who are on or close to the minimum wage? | |
| Life is an adventure or nothing at all. |
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| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 21:35 - Aug 7 with 1344 views | trampie |
| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 21:17 - Aug 7 by Pacemaker |
Nurses get 21k starting as a registered Nurse to £41k and then on and on promotion to band 8-9 which covers £40k -98k
The WAG is cutting Billions from the Local Govt budget but has decided to bring in a guaranteed living wage for NHS staff, this is laudable but how can you agree to this for the NHS which is already overspending it's budget when making local govt cut it's budget and sack people who are on or close to the minimum wage? |
21k up to 41k then on and on you say, a qualified nurse from the link I looked at seemed to be band 5 at £21,388 - £27,901 .
You never said that for the police, you didn't mention them going up and up, they go up to hundreds of thousands, over £260,000 I noted in your link.
Agendas.com is it butt ? | |
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| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 21:47 - Aug 7 with 1330 views | Pacemaker |
| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 21:35 - Aug 7 by trampie |
21k up to 41k then on and on you say, a qualified nurse from the link I looked at seemed to be band 5 at £21,388 - £27,901 .
You never said that for the police, you didn't mention them going up and up, they go up to hundreds of thousands, over £260,000 I noted in your link.
Agendas.com is it butt ? |
Nope just proving a point that not all the people you mentioned were on big money doing well out of pensions etc.
I put the link in so you could see for yourself if I had an agenda I could have left them out which is why I put both in. I only used those jobs as they were two of the easiest jobs to compare, because I knew you would agree that Nurses are under paid.
I thought it was interesting to see the nurses are on the same money as the police by and large. And the management of both are on the sort of money you would find very difficult to earn in the private sector(city of London excepted)
The days of public sector workers retiring at 48 have more or less gone due to public sector pension reform, I just thought it was a bit of a lazy post by you it's always teachers (holidays) police (overtime) fire (sleeping on nights and having second jobs) and all have decent pensions (which they all contribute to as far as I am aware) etc. | |
| Life is an adventure or nothing at all. |
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| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 21:57 - Aug 7 with 1318 views | trampie |
| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 21:47 - Aug 7 by Pacemaker |
Nope just proving a point that not all the people you mentioned were on big money doing well out of pensions etc.
I put the link in so you could see for yourself if I had an agenda I could have left them out which is why I put both in. I only used those jobs as they were two of the easiest jobs to compare, because I knew you would agree that Nurses are under paid.
I thought it was interesting to see the nurses are on the same money as the police by and large. And the management of both are on the sort of money you would find very difficult to earn in the private sector(city of London excepted)
The days of public sector workers retiring at 48 have more or less gone due to public sector pension reform, I just thought it was a bit of a lazy post by you it's always teachers (holidays) police (overtime) fire (sleeping on nights and having second jobs) and all have decent pensions (which they all contribute to as far as I am aware) etc. |
Caught you out then haven't I, you deliberately highlighted the starting pay for the police and you highlighted the top end of the pay scale in the health service.
The police are better paid, a nurse max's out at 27k, a constable at 36k, a nurse team leader at 34k and a police sergeant at 41k. | |
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| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 22:17 - Aug 7 with 1290 views | cyril |
| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 19:51 - Aug 7 by waynekerr55 |
Wow - just wow!
Tell that to them in the South East where they can't buy homes and instead pay ridiculous rents! |
They talk of the great north south divide in England , unyet those planks in cardiff are replicating the same scenario, and because they are so far up cardiffs arse, they can't see it. |  |
| The devil is in the detail |
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| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 22:32 - Aug 7 with 1269 views | Pacemaker |
| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 21:57 - Aug 7 by trampie |
Caught you out then haven't I, you deliberately highlighted the starting pay for the police and you highlighted the top end of the pay scale in the health service.
The police are better paid, a nurse max's out at 27k, a constable at 36k, a nurse team leader at 34k and a police sergeant at 41k. |
Can't see how you came to the conclusion that I failed to highlight starting pay for nurse when I clearly did. I am not familiar with nursing roles but on checking it would appear that the bands are as follows.
Band 5: £21,388 - £27,901
Nurse, midwife (entry level), theatre nurse, business administrative manager, catering manager, clinical coding officer/team leader, finance team manager, health records section manager.
Band 6: £25,783 - £34,530
Midwife, nurse specialist, nurse team leader, theatre nurse specialist, catering manager, clinical coding team manager, finance section manager, health records multi section manager, IM&T (information management and technology) analyst/technical engineer/team leader
Band 7: £30,764 - £40,558
Midwife higher level, midwife team manager, advanced nurse, nurse team manager, biomedical scientist team manager, clinical coding service manager, commissioning manager, estates manager operations/projects, finance department manager, health records department manager, healthcare scientist team manager, hotel services manager, HR team manager, IM&T section manager, improvement and development manager, information analyst advanced team manager, occupational therapist team manager, pharmacy technician team manager, physiological measurement/clinical physiology team manager, medical engineering team manager, medical physics technician section manager, procurement team manager, radiography team manager, theatre practitioner team manager
So I would suggest that they have very similar roles and pay scales except you believe one group are underpaid and one group are ripping the guts out of the public purse. No agenda just pointing out there ain't much in your argument. | |
| Life is an adventure or nothing at all. |
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| The Welsh Assembly (Government) on 22:59 - Aug 7 with 1246 views | dft |
Totally agree with some of the posts here. Lets scrap the WAG so we can go back to the days of having clueless fools control our educations system so that inequality may grow and unqualified teachers can teach our children. I want a government totally out of touch with the general public who spend huge sums of money on pally secret advisers. If you believe the WAG thinks Wales ends at Cardiff, I hate to break it to you but Westminster has been doing that for years. | | | |
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