| Political Leaders' Debate 21:03 - Apr 17 with 12722 views | finberty |
This seemed to be a 4-1 attack on Nigel Farage - 5 if you count Dimbleby.
The forgetful Greens' woman seemed from another planet with her theories.
The Plaid Cymru woman clearly felt on safe ground by attacking Farage - not for what he said, but for what (she thinks) he stands for. She got a round of applause at the previous debate so felt well able to go again on the same line. Other than that, difficult to remember what she stood for except that she, like others, believes there is a pot of gold to pay for all the spending - or 'investment' as it's now called.
Miliband came across as slightly creepy, with a faint patronising smile and air of superiority, but having said that, not as geeky as I'd thought.
As for Sturgeon, never trust a woman in high heels and thin ankles - something is bound to crack at some stage. |  | | |  |
| Political Leaders' Debate on 16:27 - Apr 21 with 2217 views | mingthemerciless |
| Political Leaders' Debate on 12:02 - Apr 21 by 49thseason |
Ming, have you been watching the BBC again? You really should know better! |
You think they'll get more than a couple then ? |  | | |
| Political Leaders' Debate on 16:39 - Apr 21 with 2174 views | HK_Dale |
| Political Leaders' Debate on 13:58 - Apr 21 by tazzydjr |
Love our their trying to keep focus on SNP watch the deciding party for the next coalition be the Greens now that'd would be a very interesting twist i know many Liberals who gone Green Party from traitors at Lib Dems (Tories Lapdog's) |
Labour / SNP coalition could be disasterous, in my opinion. But the Greens tazzy? Really? If they end up deciding who forms the government the turnout will have to be about 25%... |  | | |
| Political Leaders' Debate on 22:21 - Apr 21 with 2096 views | raadale |
| Political Leaders' Debate on 15:33 - Apr 18 by 49thseason |
The NHS is deep in the brown stuff because of the cost of the PFI deals that were signed by the last Government. Using Private finance to build Hospitals is not necessarily a problem but Gordon Brown and Milliband got well and truly stitched up by the companies that got the PFI contracts, to the extent that the cost of borrowing relatively modest initial sums of money has escalated into a monster debt that the NHS is not funded for.
From the Guardian in 2012:
"The 717 PFI contracts currently under way across the UK are funding new schools, hospitals and other public facilities with a total capital value of £54.7bn, but the overall ultimate cost will reach £301bn by the time they have been paid off over the coming decades".
"For example, while the capital cost of rebuilding Calderdale Royal Hospital in Yorkshire is £64.6m, the scheme will end up costing Calderdale and Huddersfield NHS Foundation Trust a total of £773.2m. "
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2012/jul/05/pfi-cost-300bn
The new street lights project in Rochdale has a capital cost of £31m but will eventually have cost us £112M with interest charges. (first offered for tender in 2007).Did anyone vote to spend £4+m a year for 25 years for new street lights? ... thought not.
There are a dozen schools in Rochdale which were rebuilt during the last administration (including Oulder Hill) that are now virtually unable to provide their statutory educational commitments because of the cost of their PFI contracts which were renegotiated several years ago when the original contract holder went bust! The initial cost was £44.7m the ultimate cost will be £212m with payments from £7-10m a year for 25 years!.
So thats £14M a year for the next 20-odd years being spent on two capital projects worth around £70m in the first place which probably explains why Rochdale council is skint!
But I guess everyone will still vote Labour because their dad did and their granddad did and well Rochdale is a Sh1thole but what can you do eh? |
Excellent post , it's been going on for years though. Did you know the council still have around 15/20 years (I forget the exact dates) of payments to make for the black box. Thats right we're still paying through the nose for a building that's been demolished and turned into a car park and we wonder why there's no money. Nobody is accountable...... Past governments/councils have done it, this one has done it, future ones will do it. |  | | |
| Political Leaders' Debate on 22:29 - Apr 21 with 2084 views | zxcvbnm |
| Political Leaders' Debate on 15:33 - Apr 18 by 49thseason |
The NHS is deep in the brown stuff because of the cost of the PFI deals that were signed by the last Government. Using Private finance to build Hospitals is not necessarily a problem but Gordon Brown and Milliband got well and truly stitched up by the companies that got the PFI contracts, to the extent that the cost of borrowing relatively modest initial sums of money has escalated into a monster debt that the NHS is not funded for.
From the Guardian in 2012:
"The 717 PFI contracts currently under way across the UK are funding new schools, hospitals and other public facilities with a total capital value of £54.7bn, but the overall ultimate cost will reach £301bn by the time they have been paid off over the coming decades".
"For example, while the capital cost of rebuilding Calderdale Royal Hospital in Yorkshire is £64.6m, the scheme will end up costing Calderdale and Huddersfield NHS Foundation Trust a total of £773.2m. "
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2012/jul/05/pfi-cost-300bn
The new street lights project in Rochdale has a capital cost of £31m but will eventually have cost us £112M with interest charges. (first offered for tender in 2007).Did anyone vote to spend £4+m a year for 25 years for new street lights? ... thought not.
There are a dozen schools in Rochdale which were rebuilt during the last administration (including Oulder Hill) that are now virtually unable to provide their statutory educational commitments because of the cost of their PFI contracts which were renegotiated several years ago when the original contract holder went bust! The initial cost was £44.7m the ultimate cost will be £212m with payments from £7-10m a year for 25 years!.
So thats £14M a year for the next 20-odd years being spent on two capital projects worth around £70m in the first place which probably explains why Rochdale council is skint!
But I guess everyone will still vote Labour because their dad did and their granddad did and well Rochdale is a Sh1thole but what can you do eh? |
The Treasury document also reveals that 39 further PFI projects were being procured in March this year, with total capital costs of £5.36bn, despite senior ministers including David Cameron and George Osborne having heavily criticised Labour's extensive use of PFI while in office.
These deals will add tens of billions of pounds more to the £301bn price tag.
Not just labour but the lying tories too adding to the debt mountain. |  |
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| Political Leaders' Debate (n/t) on 22:40 - Apr 21 with 2070 views | zxcvbnm |
[Post edited 21 Apr 2015 22:40]
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| Political Leaders' Debate on 23:01 - Apr 21 with 2049 views | 49thseason |
I think youmwill find that there was a major revision of PFI rules in 2013 so that the sort of contracts that Labour forced onto the NHS and Education are no longer available especially ones which include maintenance and usage clauses which added vast amounts to the overall cost.
From 1997 within weeks of telling voters that there would be no more privatised prisons, Jack Straw was busy signing another PFI contract for a private prison .
Your comments about Tories is sadly misplaced when compared to the scandalous way that NHS trusts were forced to use PFI , in many cases without the financial understanding of the long term implications . Even that bastion of left wing propaganda the Guardian has nothing good to say in support of the Blair administrations use of PFI.
Gordon Brown thought he had found a way to borrow money without it showing up in the books, it never occured to him that the rising costs would have to be paid by reducing services and ultimately jobs . I wait with baited breath for Ed Balls to start shaking this particular money tree again to see how many golden apples fall off. |  | | |
| Political Leaders' Debate (n/t) on 23:10 - Apr 21 with 2041 views | Thacks_Rabbits |
| Political Leaders' Debate (n/t) on 22:40 - Apr 21 by zxcvbnm |
[Post edited 21 Apr 2015 22:40]
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Some really interesting posts on this (Tazzy - you may be excused) but when you look at deficites, macro economics, quantative easing, inflation, budget costs, unemployment levels etc. any views we have are generally hidden within the smoke and mirrors.
Even thinking we have a clue what is going on tbh is flawed when it comes to macro economics and so on.
I think Labour screwed up big time and those saying it was global are not informed - many economies grew during "recession" and many still do!!!
The curent situation is down to many things, Tories are trying to bail out a sinking economic ship with a collander thanks to labour. Anyone saying immigration is not an issue is insane, Unemploment is higher than at any time if you take out S/E (actively harrassed to get off the sign on list) and limited / 0 hours.
Personally if I had the chance I would bring in benefits being NI related - if you have contributed you get more, you dont, or never have, you get very little. Not really rocket science! |  |
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| Political Leaders' Debate on 23:19 - Apr 21 with 2031 views | zxcvbnm |
| Political Leaders' Debate on 23:01 - Apr 21 by 49thseason |
I think youmwill find that there was a major revision of PFI rules in 2013 so that the sort of contracts that Labour forced onto the NHS and Education are no longer available especially ones which include maintenance and usage clauses which added vast amounts to the overall cost.
From 1997 within weeks of telling voters that there would be no more privatised prisons, Jack Straw was busy signing another PFI contract for a private prison .
Your comments about Tories is sadly misplaced when compared to the scandalous way that NHS trusts were forced to use PFI , in many cases without the financial understanding of the long term implications . Even that bastion of left wing propaganda the Guardian has nothing good to say in support of the Blair administrations use of PFI.
Gordon Brown thought he had found a way to borrow money without it showing up in the books, it never occured to him that the rising costs would have to be paid by reducing services and ultimately jobs . I wait with baited breath for Ed Balls to start shaking this particular money tree again to see how many golden apples fall off. |
That quote was taken from the same article you took quotes from - the tories are doing the same as labour did extortionate PFI is still happening. Now I don't trust any politician I won't be voting - they are all as corrupt as one an other and full of it.
I know labour messed up and the tories do too.
Be less blinkered - the labour party budget badly and tories make the rich richer and are poor for the public services. None of them are perfect.
I have a relation who works in the cabinet office and has done for many years - he can't say a lot naturally but what he does say is George Osbourne is thick, he describes him as completely obnoxious - he liked Ken Clarke though and actually thinks Cameron works hard for the country even if he is smarmy - he thought Gordon Brown was a tosser who used to have major tantrums when things didn't go his way. The one thing is though that they are all untrustworthy and what is put out isn't even 10% of the truth.
His advice - never believe what you read, what you hear and what you are told by any politician - they are 99.9% bull and at the end of the day they will make sure they are alright. | |
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| Political Leaders' Debate on 23:30 - Apr 21 with 2014 views | raadale |
| Political Leaders' Debate on 23:19 - Apr 21 by zxcvbnm |
That quote was taken from the same article you took quotes from - the tories are doing the same as labour did extortionate PFI is still happening. Now I don't trust any politician I won't be voting - they are all as corrupt as one an other and full of it.
I know labour messed up and the tories do too.
Be less blinkered - the labour party budget badly and tories make the rich richer and are poor for the public services. None of them are perfect.
I have a relation who works in the cabinet office and has done for many years - he can't say a lot naturally but what he does say is George Osbourne is thick, he describes him as completely obnoxious - he liked Ken Clarke though and actually thinks Cameron works hard for the country even if he is smarmy - he thought Gordon Brown was a tosser who used to have major tantrums when things didn't go his way. The one thing is though that they are all untrustworthy and what is put out isn't even 10% of the truth.
His advice - never believe what you read, what you hear and what you are told by any politician - they are 99.9% bull and at the end of the day they will make sure they are alright. |
Wasn't it Margaret Thatcher who said that Yes Minister and Yes Prime Minister were actually so ridiculously close to being accurate it was scary. All as bad as each other. | | | |
| Political Leaders' Debate on 23:33 - Apr 21 with 2012 views | D_Alien |
| Political Leaders' Debate on 23:19 - Apr 21 by zxcvbnm |
That quote was taken from the same article you took quotes from - the tories are doing the same as labour did extortionate PFI is still happening. Now I don't trust any politician I won't be voting - they are all as corrupt as one an other and full of it.
I know labour messed up and the tories do too.
Be less blinkered - the labour party budget badly and tories make the rich richer and are poor for the public services. None of them are perfect.
I have a relation who works in the cabinet office and has done for many years - he can't say a lot naturally but what he does say is George Osbourne is thick, he describes him as completely obnoxious - he liked Ken Clarke though and actually thinks Cameron works hard for the country even if he is smarmy - he thought Gordon Brown was a tosser who used to have major tantrums when things didn't go his way. The one thing is though that they are all untrustworthy and what is put out isn't even 10% of the truth.
His advice - never believe what you read, what you hear and what you are told by any politician - they are 99.9% bull and at the end of the day they will make sure they are alright. |
And your relation is bound to be the only person within the inner sanctums of government who knows what he's taking about, isn't he.
A relation = must be right. OK... |  |
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| Political Leaders' Debate on 19:01 - Apr 22 with 1941 views | mingthemerciless |
George Osbourne thick and obnoxious ? Well your relation is one smart cookie. I would have never guessed that ! What do you expect from someone who went to Eton ? [Post edited 22 Apr 2015 19:06]
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| Political Leaders' Debate on 20:08 - Apr 22 with 1901 views | EllGazzell |
| Political Leaders' Debate on 22:38 - Apr 20 by D_Alien |
I think you should Nigel Farage know, especially whilst tazzy's in the Czech Republic. If UKIP hold the balance of power after the election, tazzy might find himself stranded in mittel Europe
[Post edited 20 Apr 2015 22:40]
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Don't worry, it's part of the shengen here so he'll be able to get all the way back to calais unhindered and swim the last bit to get back to blighty.
... Or he could work for me teaching English.. maybe not eh... |  |
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