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Big announcement today on the future of 3 thousand directly employed and god knows how many service jobs will disappear .All for chasing the impossible dream of net zero , the biggest con in this generations history
"In a free society, the State is the servant of the people—not the master."
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Port Talbot Tata on 13:40 - Jan 20 with 1254 views
Dutch TATA blast furnace upgrades are still the equivalent polluters that they are shutting down here. The virgin steel we’ll need to import wasn’t manufactured using pixi dust is it? I find it shocking that calculation of carbon emissions on imported products…including the transportation are not included in the UK figures. Tory or Labour government will not change a thing.
This carbon footprint, emissions controls and green energy is mostly all about one thing, robbing yet more money off the hard working tax payer, one of the smallest Countries in the World geographically and we are trying to be the leaders in all three of the above, its not rationale or achievable.
That's the said reality and the man on the street is having to pay for it all.
Massive push in EV's when the structure isn't ready, the batteries on these electric cars don't like the cold weather either, they take longer to charge and can lose between 10 and 30% of their charge.
Since the yanks blew up Nord 2 pipeline and released 12 million tons of methane into the atmosphere, I holed any attempt at reducing c02 with total contempt
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Port Talbot Tata on 17:40 - Jan 20 with 1174 views
Port Talbot Tata on 17:40 - Jan 20 by Kilkennyjack
Blame Farage
Wrong about everything.
You could argue he was right on this one.
Firstly despite the bad news there will still be an albeit smaller steel industry in the UK.
If we were still in the EU the government would have had difficulty in proving subsidies.
Of course if the steel industry was nationalised we'd have the same group of people banging on about public sector inefficiency, taxpayer value for money and destructive unions.
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Port Talbot Tata on 12:44 - Jan 21 with 1021 views
Firstly despite the bad news there will still be an albeit smaller steel industry in the UK.
If we were still in the EU the government would have had difficulty in proving subsidies.
Of course if the steel industry was nationalised we'd have the same group of people banging on about public sector inefficiency, taxpayer value for money and destructive unions.
It doesn't seem to have affected the Netherlands, apparently, Tata are investing heavily there
Firstly despite the bad news there will still be an albeit smaller steel industry in the UK.
If we were still in the EU the government would have had difficulty in proving subsidies.
Of course if the steel industry was nationalised we'd have the same group of people banging on about public sector inefficiency, taxpayer value for money and destructive unions.
Tata are investing inside of the EU. Almost certainly because they want to sell into the EU.
We are ,of course, on Idiot Island now trying to compete with China, India and the like. A suicide mission.
Brexit was not in the interests of the working man. Brexit was in the interests of the monied classes who want to make more money of the long hours of the workers. Free ports are next up for the Singapore of Europe.
The investment in Port Talbot to recycle scrap steel (electric arc) seems to bring only marginal benefit to the UK. What we really need is hydrogen and primary steel production for the longer term. It seems to me worth a bigger subsidy together with investment from a partner to get to that. Plus we;d be best to keep one blast furnace for now, even if mothballed.
Port Talbot Tata on 14:39 - Jan 21 by Kilkennyjack
Tata are investing inside of the EU. Almost certainly because they want to sell into the EU.
We are ,of course, on Idiot Island now trying to compete with China, India and the like. A suicide mission.
Brexit was not in the interests of the working man. Brexit was in the interests of the monied classes who want to make more money of the long hours of the workers. Free ports are next up for the Singapore of Europe.
Annibyniaeth.
Have to say I agree Why the working class ,as they are called ,voted to leave I will never know . However, Cameron and his band of lying bustards did a great bullpopping job A whole island kidded
I have been made redundant twice and had to act fast to avoid going bankrupt and losing my house. I was paid £3000 redundancy with a £700 pcm mortgage. This is a bad set back but not the end of the world. No one cried for me. I just got on with it.
My Uncle was relocated from Ebbw Vale to Ravenscraig over 50 years ago and now has Scottish family.
I tend to have no empathy for areas that voted for Brexit. It is probably not related to Europe in this case but Bridgend certainly was. European funding would have come no doubt.
The air is filthy in PT and the grime is clearly visible on a hot summer day hovering over the town. I predicted this plant would shut down 10 years ago. It never had a future against India and China with rock bottom wages and poor worker welfare.
Port Talbot will not be decimated. The people are strong and will find new cleaner jobs. They will probably live longer but with less cash. To new projects in Wales. The Munitions factory in Gwent and the gas fired power station in Hirwaun two I am aware of.
We are in the post industrial era and these are the last knockings. Good riddance and welcome clean air. Wales do not need these filthy jobs.
Sorry but this is absolute nonsense. We are about to see 5000 people lose their jobs in the area. There are not even 5000 minimum wage jobs out there to provide for them.
As for the eco mantra its a load of nonsense all we are doing is offshoring our pollution to India and China who no doubt will open another steel plant to help meet our demand.
What jobs does Wales need because it appears at the minute as though we do not need any and we can all become unemployed. There is nothing good coming here, only unemployment and destitution.
Tata are creating 4k new jobs in Shropshire though? That wouldve been nice, but im sure certain brown envelopes had their say in that one.
Have to say I agree Why the working class ,as they are called ,voted to leave I will never know . However, Cameron and his band of lying bustards did a great bullpopping job A whole island kidded
Racism pure and simple. So many thought that the immigrant "issue" would be solved by us leaving the EU. So they voted in the hope that those here would be sent home and those they thought would come in the future wouldn't. The Sun snd the Mail fed the lies and too many swallowed them whole. I know many who believed the "cure" to the "immigration issue" was to vote to leave
"Sanity and happiness are an impossible combination" - Mark Twain
Racism pure and simple. So many thought that the immigrant "issue" would be solved by us leaving the EU. So they voted in the hope that those here would be sent home and those they thought would come in the future wouldn't. The Sun snd the Mail fed the lies and too many swallowed them whole. I know many who believed the "cure" to the "immigration issue" was to vote to leave
And yet I doubt that we would be in a better position re immigration if we were still in the EU. Regarding irregular migration, there were about 874,000 asylum applications in the EU in 2022 and almost 650,000 in the first eight months of 2023, as well as 4.2 million Ukrainians. With freedom of movement, persons who eventually obtained citizenship of an EU country would be able to settle in the UK. It is true that when it comes to regular migration, entries to the UK from the EU have fallen and those from non-EU countries have risen, but this should have been wholly under the Government's control. The drivers are mainly the 3 nationality-specific migration schemes (Ukraine, Hong Kong and Afghanistan), rising student numbers and relaxed rules on dependents and staying on after graduation, and recruitment for the health and care sectors and seasonal work. All these categories reflected policy decisions that could have been otherwise. There were always many more non-EU students than EU students, so that category hasn't changed greatly except for the rule changes mentioned. Presumably, the numbers entering under the nationality-based schemes will now fall. The most difficult category to control, and the one that may have seen the biggest ongoing shift from EU to non-EU entrants, is shortage occupations. To my mind though the difference post-BREXIT is that we can control numbers if our Government is minded to do so. You will recall that in the period before the referendum, David Cameron's request to change the rules on freedom of movement and access to welfare benefits was turned down by the Commission, meaning that we did not have full control. I also think the long term pressure would have been to join the Schengen area, meaning even less control of borders than we did have. People will probably mention the Dublin Regulation, but the fact is that we were accepting as many inward transfers as outward transfers in the last few years before we left the Union. As things have turned out we are not in a great situation re immigration, but probably a marginally better one than that of France or Germany.
And yet I doubt that we would be in a better position re immigration if we were still in the EU. Regarding irregular migration, there were about 874,000 asylum applications in the EU in 2022 and almost 650,000 in the first eight months of 2023, as well as 4.2 million Ukrainians. With freedom of movement, persons who eventually obtained citizenship of an EU country would be able to settle in the UK. It is true that when it comes to regular migration, entries to the UK from the EU have fallen and those from non-EU countries have risen, but this should have been wholly under the Government's control. The drivers are mainly the 3 nationality-specific migration schemes (Ukraine, Hong Kong and Afghanistan), rising student numbers and relaxed rules on dependents and staying on after graduation, and recruitment for the health and care sectors and seasonal work. All these categories reflected policy decisions that could have been otherwise. There were always many more non-EU students than EU students, so that category hasn't changed greatly except for the rule changes mentioned. Presumably, the numbers entering under the nationality-based schemes will now fall. The most difficult category to control, and the one that may have seen the biggest ongoing shift from EU to non-EU entrants, is shortage occupations. To my mind though the difference post-BREXIT is that we can control numbers if our Government is minded to do so. You will recall that in the period before the referendum, David Cameron's request to change the rules on freedom of movement and access to welfare benefits was turned down by the Commission, meaning that we did not have full control. I also think the long term pressure would have been to join the Schengen area, meaning even less control of borders than we did have. People will probably mention the Dublin Regulation, but the fact is that we were accepting as many inward transfers as outward transfers in the last few years before we left the Union. As things have turned out we are not in a great situation re immigration, but probably a marginally better one than that of France or Germany.
[Post edited 21 Jan 20:18]
They told deliberate lies. Immigration has factually increased, not decreased, since Brexit.
They lied because they wanted to leave the EU to deregulate and fill their own pockets - whilst all wrapped in the union flag. Shite in our rivers and coastline is a direct Brexit ‘benefit’. Rotting fruit in supermarkets another. No trade deal with the US, which they also promised. There are many examples. Now Steel ….
Mogg moved his business to Dublin. Johnson’s father suddenly got a French passport. 2 of Farages children hold German passports. See the pattern ? ….. Brexit is different for the elites.
Port Talbot Tata on 21:57 - Jan 21 by Kilkennyjack
They told deliberate lies. Immigration has factually increased, not decreased, since Brexit.
They lied because they wanted to leave the EU to deregulate and fill their own pockets - whilst all wrapped in the union flag. Shite in our rivers and coastline is a direct Brexit ‘benefit’. Rotting fruit in supermarkets another. No trade deal with the US, which they also promised. There are many examples. Now Steel ….
Mogg moved his business to Dublin. Johnson’s father suddenly got a French passport. 2 of Farages children hold German passports. See the pattern ? ….. Brexit is different for the elites.
You never seem to answer when I point out that the imposition by the EU of the EDP on the Republic of Ireland had a devasting effect on its healthcare system from which it has yet to recover. You praise a system that has left Ireland with the highest uptake of private medical insurance in Western Europe, with those who can paying to get care in a two-tier system. Greece suffered even more under the Troika. If you love the EU so much it is but a short ferry ride from Pembroke and you already have a passport.
You never seem to answer when I point out that the imposition by the EU of the EDP on the Republic of Ireland had a devasting effect on its healthcare system from which it has yet to recover. You praise a system that has left Ireland with the highest uptake of private medical insurance in Western Europe, with those who can paying to get care in a two-tier system. Greece suffered even more under the Troika. If you love the EU so much it is but a short ferry ride from Pembroke and you already have a passport.
Racism pure and simple. So many thought that the immigrant "issue" would be solved by us leaving the EU. So they voted in the hope that those here would be sent home and those they thought would come in the future wouldn't. The Sun snd the Mail fed the lies and too many swallowed them whole. I know many who believed the "cure" to the "immigration issue" was to vote to leave
One of the few times,we agree 100% Even now I can’t believe areas with traditional Labour voters showed the highest percentages to leave . Everything down to the foreigners etc. I’m all for stopping illegals but quality people are needed here . My son was living in The Hague at the time of the vote and was astounded at what we had done . Still is.
The investment in Port Talbot to recycle scrap steel (electric arc) seems to bring only marginal benefit to the UK. What we really need is hydrogen and primary steel production for the longer term. It seems to me worth a bigger subsidy together with investment from a partner to get to that. Plus we;d be best to keep one blast furnace for now, even if mothballed.
TBH I cannot see Tata building a new furnace, we are seeing the first moves of total closure.
One of the few times,we agree 100% Even now I can’t believe areas with traditional Labour voters showed the highest percentages to leave . Everything down to the foreigners etc. I’m all for stopping illegals but quality people are needed here . My son was living in The Hague at the time of the vote and was astounded at what we had done . Still is.
Unfortunately when large areas of the country are pretty poor and in a bad state people vote for whatever change is on offer. Under the premise that changing something is better than the continued decline.
Some would say that's a small price to pay for a booming economy
and a lot of working class wouldn't agree despite the so called boom ,there's many more examples of citizens reactions against a deliberate policy of swamping a country which like the UK hasn't the infrastructure to support such numbers
"In a free society, the State is the servant of the people—not the master."
and a lot of working class wouldn't agree despite the so called boom ,there's many more examples of citizens reactions against a deliberate policy of swamping a country which like the UK hasn't the infrastructure to support such numbers
I would take a booming economy and infrastructure over a few illegals anyday.
Some would say that's a small price to pay for a booming economy
A booming economy and an unequal society. I had you down as somebody on the Left who would be against dependency on private healthcare and the devil take those without enough money to pay.
After the EU imposed the excessive deficit procedure on the RoI, austerity policies ruled for some years and the % of GDP spent on public healthcare plummeted. In recent years there has been huge pressure to do something to make the system fairer. The Government came up with plans to end two-tier care by introducing a new system called Sláintecare, but this is moving forward at a snail's pace. One thing that comes up in the current working class protests is that the migrants can access healthcare more easily than the protesters can.
You never seem to answer when I point out that the imposition by the EU of the EDP on the Republic of Ireland had a devasting effect on its healthcare system from which it has yet to recover. You praise a system that has left Ireland with the highest uptake of private medical insurance in Western Europe, with those who can paying to get care in a two-tier system. Greece suffered even more under the Troika. If you love the EU so much it is but a short ferry ride from Pembroke and you already have a passport.
The title of the thread is Port Talbot Tata.
Why would we discuss Health care in Ireland instead ?
Well done to Swans btw
Brexit is directly responsible for these dreadful job losses.
A booming economy and an unequal society. I had you down as somebody on the Left who would be against dependency on private healthcare and the devil take those without enough money to pay.
After the EU imposed the excessive deficit procedure on the RoI, austerity policies ruled for some years and the % of GDP spent on public healthcare plummeted. In recent years there has been huge pressure to do something to make the system fairer. The Government came up with plans to end two-tier care by introducing a new system called Sláintecare, but this is moving forward at a snail's pace. One thing that comes up in the current working class protests is that the migrants can access healthcare more easily than the protesters can.
Illegals can’t access healthcare, they can if they are legit
Have to say I agree Why the working class ,as they are called ,voted to leave I will never know . However, Cameron and his band of lying bustards did a great bullpopping job A whole island kidded
Sorry but you're wrong there, Cameron and Osborne put out a pro EU leaflet and were firmly in the REMAIN camp. Cameron never thought for a second we'd vote to leave and when we did he chickened out and rsesigned despite saying he'd stay on whatever the result.
PS, there was absolutely NO racism involved in my choice. Painting so many millions racist because they disgree with you is wrong. I don't doubt there was racims for a large number but not anywhere near the majority.
That's all I have to say on this because it's in the past, it's done and dusted. We should look forward on this and not keep moaning about those things we cannot change. It caused enough arguments back then.
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