| Have we finally had enough 08:20 - Jan 10 with 4212 views | SullutaCreturned |
What we have seen with the Post Office scandal, the mass outpouring of support for those poor people, is this the start of us using our voices and making the powers that be pay attention, or is it just a flash in the pan?
Will the great British public stand together going forward, will social media drive people on to demand what is fair and right and will a unfied voice see changes happen? Or will we all just climb back into our boxes? |  | | |  |
| Have we finally had enough on 08:50 - Jan 10 with 2644 views | Thrasher6 |
I truly hope so....good post. |  |
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| Have we finally had enough on 09:02 - Jan 10 with 2632 views | Boundy |
IMO a flash in the pan, sad to think that we as society just accept what ever injustices are thrown our way , the Horizon scandal has certainly raised the social consciousness and hopefully it could be the start of a a bigger ground swell of public opinion on other subjects such as sexualisation of children , the fact that energy company's are still ripping customers including the big retailers not passing on the reduction of oil prices. Inept politicians who implement policies which are to the detriment of the constituents they represent , a big list to work through so good luck | |
| "In a free society, the State is the servant of the people—not the master." |
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| Have we finally had enough on 09:30 - Jan 10 with 2609 views | onehunglow |
We will see.
Something need to change though
It’s a long time since a TV prog has had such an impact
Cathy Cone Home drew similar indignation | |
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| Have we finally had enough on 09:36 - Jan 10 with 2610 views | JACKMANANDBOY |
| Have we finally had enough on 09:02 - Jan 10 by Boundy |
IMO a flash in the pan, sad to think that we as society just accept what ever injustices are thrown our way , the Horizon scandal has certainly raised the social consciousness and hopefully it could be the start of a a bigger ground swell of public opinion on other subjects such as sexualisation of children , the fact that energy company's are still ripping customers including the big retailers not passing on the reduction of oil prices. Inept politicians who implement policies which are to the detriment of the constituents they represent , a big list to work through so good luck |
I would add that the coverage of the Post Office Scandal has highlighted the role of journalism in a Liberal Democracy holding those in authority and power to account.
Too much journalism is 'tabloid' in nature as competition in the news media has led to editors seeking clicks and views rather than the serious stuff, this together with political bias and campaigning for particular causes in the news media means matters of consequence are not given a thorough independent investigation and are being replaced by opinion to promote a particular view of matters.
Well done to ITV on the Post Office Scandal, not only a decent review of the case but a very good dramatic production to get people's attention. |  |
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| Have we finally had enough on 09:42 - Jan 10 with 2607 views | KeithHaynes |
| Have we finally had enough on 09:36 - Jan 10 by JACKMANANDBOY |
I would add that the coverage of the Post Office Scandal has highlighted the role of journalism in a Liberal Democracy holding those in authority and power to account.
Too much journalism is 'tabloid' in nature as competition in the news media has led to editors seeking clicks and views rather than the serious stuff, this together with political bias and campaigning for particular causes in the news media means matters of consequence are not given a thorough independent investigation and are being replaced by opinion to promote a particular view of matters.
Well done to ITV on the Post Office Scandal, not only a decent review of the case but a very good dramatic production to get people's attention. |
I’m still surprised Adam crozier got away without a mention. |  |
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| Have we finally had enough on 09:48 - Jan 10 with 2596 views | onehunglow |
| Have we finally had enough on 09:42 - Jan 10 by KeithHaynes |
I’m still surprised Adam crozier got away without a mention. |
He got mentioned this morning .
It’s a shitstirm | |
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| Have we finally had enough on 10:48 - Jan 10 with 2573 views | controversial_jack |
| Have we finally had enough on 09:48 - Jan 10 by onehunglow |
He got mentioned this morning .
It’s a shitstirm |
If this is perjury , perverting the course of justice or whatever, then examples need to be made. Also, PO powers of prosecution need to be removed. | | | |
| Have we finally had enough on 11:01 - Jan 10 with 2571 views | 1983 |
Just ask the families of the Hillsborough disaster |  |
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| Have we finally had enough on 11:17 - Jan 10 with 2563 views | Treforys_Jack |
The problem is that we rarely find out about any such miscarriage of justice or corruption unless the media decide to tell us. And even then its usually many years later as is this case, and money, wealth and reputation still carry far too much weight. |  | | |
| Have we finally had enough on 11:30 - Jan 10 with 2555 views | JACKMANANDBOY |
| Have we finally had enough on 11:17 - Jan 10 by Treforys_Jack |
The problem is that we rarely find out about any such miscarriage of justice or corruption unless the media decide to tell us. And even then its usually many years later as is this case, and money, wealth and reputation still carry far too much weight. |
Here's an issue largely ignored by the UK Media. It's from abroad but illustrates your point. 1.7M Afghans being forced out of Pakistan including people born in Pakistan having all their assets taken and pushed to the hands of the Taliban.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.aljazeera.com/amp/news/2023/11/22/whats-wrong-t | |
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| Have we finally had enough on 11:39 - Jan 10 with 2548 views | Thrasher6 |
| Have we finally had enough on 11:17 - Jan 10 by Treforys_Jack |
The problem is that we rarely find out about any such miscarriage of justice or corruption unless the media decide to tell us. And even then its usually many years later as is this case, and money, wealth and reputation still carry far too much weight. |
Private Eye did....but generally people don't want to know....they simply ignore the important matters and carry on watching soap operas etc. You have to ram it right in front of people before they react. | |
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| Have we finally had enough on 12:06 - Jan 10 with 2522 views | Kilkennyjack |
The UK has a rabid right wing print media and a Tory led BBC.
The young read and watch neither.
They pumped out populist crap to protect Johnson for years.
The Met appear compromised.
You are right about the people though.
Good people have had enough of the lies and corruption.
A Labour landslide will allow investigations into Russian interference, Fast Lane PPE, and stop this FreePort/Chartered Cities game.
They have been going after Starmer hard since the New Year.
I think you are right about Social Media as well.
They will keep on about small boats because the record is shickingly bad. |  |
| Beware of the Risen People
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| Have we finally had enough on 16:07 - Jan 10 with 2475 views | felixstowe_jack |
| Have we finally had enough on 12:06 - Jan 10 by Kilkennyjack |
The UK has a rabid right wing print media and a Tory led BBC.
The young read and watch neither.
They pumped out populist crap to protect Johnson for years.
The Met appear compromised.
You are right about the people though.
Good people have had enough of the lies and corruption.
A Labour landslide will allow investigations into Russian interference, Fast Lane PPE, and stop this FreePort/Chartered Cities game.
They have been going after Starmer hard since the New Year.
I think you are right about Social Media as well.
They will keep on about small boats because the record is shickingly bad. |
Good to see a UK government finally delivering justice for the wrongly convicted postmaster, most of who were convicted when Labour were I power.
Just hope the SNP can sort it quickly as the have a different legal system than England and Wales.
Note Starmer was head of DPP for 5 years when these convictions were going on.
In Scotland it was the procurator Fiscal who prosecuted in innocent postmaster not the Post Office Lawyers. | |
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| Have we finally had enough on 16:31 - Jan 10 with 2452 views | controversial_jack |
| Have we finally had enough on 16:07 - Jan 10 by felixstowe_jack |
Good to see a UK government finally delivering justice for the wrongly convicted postmaster, most of who were convicted when Labour were I power.
Just hope the SNP can sort it quickly as the have a different legal system than England and Wales.
Note Starmer was head of DPP for 5 years when these convictions were going on.
In Scotland it was the procurator Fiscal who prosecuted in innocent postmaster not the Post Office Lawyers. |
It shouldn't be down to the govt to intervene in judicial matters. The CPSs wasn't invoked in these prosecutions as has been previously pointed out, they were brought by the PO | | | |
| Have we finally had enough on 17:13 - Jan 10 with 2442 views | felixstowe_jack |
| Have we finally had enough on 16:31 - Jan 10 by controversial_jack |
It shouldn't be down to the govt to intervene in judicial matters. The CPSs wasn't invoked in these prosecutions as has been previously pointed out, they were brought by the PO |
Correct but the CPS still has oversight and control of private prosecutions. They can take over private prosecutions if they wish. Surely someone in either the CPS or justice system must have noticed the huge increase in Post Office Prosecutions. They do have to allocate court time and judges to try these cases.
The enquiry needs to find out how much the CPS knew and when.
The same cannot be said in Scotland as the procurator fiscal prosecuted all the cases as the Post Office did not have the right too under Scottish law. | |
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| Have we finally had enough on 17:46 - Jan 10 with 2420 views | KeithHaynes |
Pitchfork uprising ! | |
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| Have we finally had enough on 18:01 - Jan 10 with 2396 views | Boundy |
| Have we finally had enough on 17:46 - Jan 10 by KeithHaynes |
Pitchfork uprising ! |
If only . I have mine sharpened and ready | |
| "In a free society, the State is the servant of the people—not the master." |
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| Have we finally had enough on 18:03 - Jan 10 with 2393 views | onehunglow |
| Have we finally had enough on 16:07 - Jan 10 by felixstowe_jack |
Good to see a UK government finally delivering justice for the wrongly convicted postmaster, most of who were convicted when Labour were I power.
Just hope the SNP can sort it quickly as the have a different legal system than England and Wales.
Note Starmer was head of DPP for 5 years when these convictions were going on.
In Scotland it was the procurator Fiscal who prosecuted in innocent postmaster not the Post Office Lawyers. |
Everyone should be exonerated immediately and all compensated in full.
Where did the money taken under duress gone ? | |
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| Have we finally had enough on 19:48 - Jan 10 with 2359 views | AnotherJohn |
| Have we finally had enough on 18:03 - Jan 10 by onehunglow |
Everyone should be exonerated immediately and all compensated in full.
Where did the money taken under duress gone ? |
That would be the ideal, but it will be interesting to see whether legislation is used to quash all the unjust convictions in a stroke or if those who argue that this would undermine the separation of powers get their way. In that event it would be left to the judiciary to overturn convictions on a case by case basis and take much longer. My own view is that the legislature should have ultimate power in the UK system - we are different from the USA. | | | |
| Have we finally had enough on 19:57 - Jan 10 with 2350 views | SullutaCreturned |
| Have we finally had enough on 18:03 - Jan 10 by onehunglow |
Everyone should be exonerated immediately and all compensated in full.
Where did the money taken under duress gone ? |
The money probably just went into P.O. profits. The government are trying to change it so the Po can no longer prosecute. They need to go after the senior managers, well anybody who knew these prosecutions were wrong actually. One of the cases in the tv show, they had no evidence of wrongdoing but they took her to court and convinved her pleading guilty was the only way to stay out of jail, it's cruel and unusual and somebody deffo needs locking up for that alone.
Fijitsu need taking in hand too, they knew the system was shite, they were manipulating it in real time. They should have to contribute to compensation.
I expect a few underlings will be scapegoated and the guiltiest culprits (highest up the chain) will be left alone. In itself that would also be criminal in my opinion but I reckon it's going to be so.
felix, the CPS had nothing to do with the prosecutions, they would hardly have noticed 800 court cases all across the UK in amongst the millions every year.
PS, I hope we have had enough, I hope we never again just si back with apathy and say we can't change it. The tv news and print media could help, it could be their new crusade to get this country back into a better place instead of helping those turning it into some kind of slum landlord paradise. [Post edited 10 Jan 19:59]
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| Have we finally had enough on 20:07 - Jan 10 with 2332 views | Gwyn737 |
| Have we finally had enough on 09:36 - Jan 10 by JACKMANANDBOY |
I would add that the coverage of the Post Office Scandal has highlighted the role of journalism in a Liberal Democracy holding those in authority and power to account.
Too much journalism is 'tabloid' in nature as competition in the news media has led to editors seeking clicks and views rather than the serious stuff, this together with political bias and campaigning for particular causes in the news media means matters of consequence are not given a thorough independent investigation and are being replaced by opinion to promote a particular view of matters.
Well done to ITV on the Post Office Scandal, not only a decent review of the case but a very good dramatic production to get people's attention. |
So true.
We can argue about press bias but we should look towards the US as a cautionary tale. I doubt they’d ever produce such a programme, polarised as they are.
ITV programming, Panorama on the BBC and Channel 4s Despatches have done superb jobs over the years.
OHL mentioned Kathy Comes Home which had a huge impact. More recently, the partygate drama really put the rockets under the justice system.
This kind of journalism are jewels of what we produce. Hopefully it’ll continue. | | | |
| Have we finally had enough on 20:11 - Jan 10 with 2326 views | onehunglow |
| Have we finally had enough on 19:57 - Jan 10 by SullutaCreturned |
The money probably just went into P.O. profits. The government are trying to change it so the Po can no longer prosecute. They need to go after the senior managers, well anybody who knew these prosecutions were wrong actually. One of the cases in the tv show, they had no evidence of wrongdoing but they took her to court and convinved her pleading guilty was the only way to stay out of jail, it's cruel and unusual and somebody deffo needs locking up for that alone.
Fijitsu need taking in hand too, they knew the system was shite, they were manipulating it in real time. They should have to contribute to compensation.
I expect a few underlings will be scapegoated and the guiltiest culprits (highest up the chain) will be left alone. In itself that would also be criminal in my opinion but I reckon it's going to be so.
felix, the CPS had nothing to do with the prosecutions, they would hardly have noticed 800 court cases all across the UK in amongst the millions every year.
PS, I hope we have had enough, I hope we never again just si back with apathy and say we can't change it. The tv news and print media could help, it could be their new crusade to get this country back into a better place instead of helping those turning it into some kind of slum landlord paradise. [Post edited 10 Jan 19:59]
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Indeed so
If the system was flawed and they knew that then accepting that money and by intimidation sounds sinister to me
We need these people flushed out | |
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| Have we finally had enough on 20:41 - Jan 10 with 2307 views | swan65split |
stephen Flynn is correct ...we don't stand a chance against the establishment! ,,,in whatever the issues are. |  | | |
| Have we finally had enough on 21:08 - Jan 10 with 2286 views | majorraglan |
| Have we finally had enough on 16:07 - Jan 10 by felixstowe_jack |
Good to see a UK government finally delivering justice for the wrongly convicted postmaster, most of who were convicted when Labour were I power.
Just hope the SNP can sort it quickly as the have a different legal system than England and Wales.
Note Starmer was head of DPP for 5 years when these convictions were going on.
In Scotland it was the procurator Fiscal who prosecuted in innocent postmaster not the Post Office Lawyers. |
I noticed that the Conservative supporting Daily Telegraph highlighted Starmer’s position as the Head of the CPS in an attempt to shift some of the responsibility on him, what they didn’t say is that the Post Office were prosecuting the overwhelming majority of these cases themselves which meant the CPS were not involved.
The CPS have today confirmed that it prosecuted 11 post masters where evidence was provided by Horizon, 3 were subsequently found guilty. Starmer has said no Post Office cases ended up on his desk, and to be honest I’d have been surprised if they had.
Alan Bates reported his concerns to Computer Weekly in 2004, however it was only in 2009 that they had sufficient evidence to publish the article. Labour left power in 2010 , since then we’ve had 13 years of Conservative government who’ve not done a great deal about it until this week and then I suspect it’s only in response to the public anger.
It’s worth adding in amongst all these miss carriages of justice there would have been some cases where Post Masters had been dishonest [Post edited 10 Jan 21:11]
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