| Strikers 14:26 - Feb 20 with 6361 views | Myke |
During our slump/blip (delete where appropriate) we have heard the usual nonsense trotted out about the fact that we are 'lacking ambition' because we didn't sign another attacker during the window. Same people I am sure who still think we should have splashed out millions on Wells (2 goals so far this season) The fact is we did 'splash out' on a an attacker who's main asset allegedly was to use his speed to get in behind the defence - Gray. We saw it splendidly against WBA and against Cardiff and ...err.... well that's it really. 5 goals from 20 appearances is a pretty poor return. (Garnished us a few points I'll grant you that, but still) We were supposed to have three different types of strikers 'Poacher' Austin (ahem), 'physical' Dykes(ahem) and 'mobile' Gray (ahem ahem) So while all three have struggled this season, I don't think the club is at fault - all three are costing (or have costed us) a decent wedge and I think all three need to up their game on the run in. |  | | |  |
| Strikers on 15:44 - Feb 20 with 3891 views | essextaxiboy |
Grey jouned us in August and has done nothing bar the games you mention IMO we should have got a loan striker in Jan instead of another midfielder ,not a permanent signing .If we dont make the playoffs the failure to do so will be the reasom .IMO |  | | |
| Strikers on 15:47 - Feb 20 with 3872 views | Wegerles_Stairs |
| Strikers on 15:44 - Feb 20 by essextaxiboy |
Grey jouned us in August and has done nothing bar the games you mention IMO we should have got a loan striker in Jan instead of another midfielder ,not a permanent signing .If we dont make the playoffs the failure to do so will be the reasom .IMO |
Completely agree. Shocking lack of foresight. If we'd beaten Bournemouth, the tie with City would have covered the outlay. I'll wager we'd have won more than one point from the last three games too. | | | |
| Strikers on 17:36 - Feb 20 with 3711 views | ParkRoyalR |
| Strikers on 17:05 - Feb 20 by Phil_i_P_Daddy |
Couldnāt disagree more with your description of Dykes Iām sorry to say. Iāve yet to see him dominate in the air, out-muscle anyone or hold the ball up/lay it off with any consistency. Unfortunately, I donāt see that heās developing either.
Alas, we canāt compete in the proven goalscorer market and are reliant on finding a diamond in the rough who isnāt too good and gets taken off us by a bigger club half way through the season. |
Any thoughts on our 2nd and 3rd choice strikers? | | | |
| Strikers on 17:58 - Feb 20 with 3647 views | PlanetHonneywood |
Yeah weāre light up-top, but while promotion was always a long shot coming into the season, I think the bigger issue is whatās the team/squad going to look like come August?
We have a number of players out of contract soon; five talents likely to attract interest; four loanees to leave; and those for whom age and injury will see even less games being played,
My concern is how we keep the momentum under MW going, when there could be a lot of ins and outs from a summer where heās having to rebuild not merely reset. Because as we know, some of our brethren can get tetchy if weāre not 3-up at half-time in the first game! |  |
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| Strikers on 19:49 - Feb 20 with 3506 views | derbyhoop |
| Strikers on 17:58 - Feb 20 by PlanetHonneywood |
Yeah weāre light up-top, but while promotion was always a long shot coming into the season, I think the bigger issue is whatās the team/squad going to look like come August?
We have a number of players out of contract soon; five talents likely to attract interest; four loanees to leave; and those for whom age and injury will see even less games being played,
My concern is how we keep the momentum under MW going, when there could be a lot of ins and outs from a summer where heās having to rebuild not merely reset. Because as we know, some of our brethren can get tetchy if weāre not 3-up at half-time in the first game! |
Nail on head, John
None of the 3 strikers have been that good this season.
Dykes offers a physical presence and work rate but I can't see him being a prolific scorer. At Championship level. God knows, what would happen if we get up to PL.
Austin doesn't look fit. He was never quick but it seems the game has got too quick for him to show the poaching instinct he had before.
If Gray doesn't score, he's a liability.
Kelman is young but is he any better than L2?
Armstrong is big, quick but as raw as they come?
Any others? |  |
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Find me on twitter @derbyhoop |
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| Strikers on 19:51 - Feb 20 with 3502 views | Northernr |
You're where I am Myke. Strikers cost serious money, which we don't have. Even if you do spend serious money, you might end up with Wells, Madine, Zahore. A few years ago we could only loan strikers and take our chances, some went well some didn't. Now we can afford to own a couple, but they're not very good really. It is what it is, unless you can spot a Vardy type playing for bloody Halifax. |  | | |
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| Strikers on 21:24 - Feb 20 with 3338 views | essextaxiboy |
| Strikers on 19:51 - Feb 20 by Northernr |
You're where I am Myke. Strikers cost serious money, which we don't have. Even if you do spend serious money, you might end up with Wells, Madine, Zahore. A few years ago we could only loan strikers and take our chances, some went well some didn't. Now we can afford to own a couple, but they're not very good really. It is what it is, unless you can spot a Vardy type playing for bloody Halifax. |
A loan striker in Jan was surely within our reach . We could have passed on Hendrick .it may of worked may not , but at least it would hav shook things up . | | | |
| Strikers on 22:46 - Feb 20 with 3219 views | ngbqpr |
| Strikers on 15:47 - Feb 20 by Wegerles_Stairs |
Completely agree. Shocking lack of foresight. If we'd beaten Bournemouth, the tie with City would have covered the outlay. I'll wager we'd have won more than one point from the last three games too. |
If only life / football was so simple. |  |
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| Strikers on 22:51 - Feb 20 with 3208 views | Northernr |
| Strikers on 21:24 - Feb 20 by essextaxiboy |
A loan striker in Jan was surely within our reach . We could have passed on Hendrick .it may of worked may not , but at least it would hav shook things up . |
But again, not to be a dick, but can you name a striker or attacker that moved in January within our budget who's doing well? West Brom spent Ā£8m on Dike - injured. Boro committed Ā£3m to loaning Balogen - most of their fans think Whatmore is better.
Who are these strikers kicking around for us? Where are they? | | | |
| Strikers on 23:16 - Feb 20 with 3173 views | ParkRoyalR |
| Strikers on 22:51 - Feb 20 by Northernr |
But again, not to be a dick, but can you name a striker or attacker that moved in January within our budget who's doing well? West Brom spent Ā£8m on Dike - injured. Boro committed Ā£3m to loaning Balogen - most of their fans think Whatmore is better.
Who are these strikers kicking around for us? Where are they? |
I genuinely believe we already have one, if Chair can play like Willock and get his head up and play the early pass. Dykes movement and positioning is much improved (if still too tepid with his shooting at times) but so noticeable at Millwall in 2nd Half that the simple early pass from Chair was never forthcoming. Chair's most effective attacking play is that pass to Wallace and hopefully Moses or McCallum can pick up where Wallace left off, as a good Centre Forward will thrive on that cutback. | | | |
| Strikers on 23:26 - Feb 20 with 3147 views | FrankRightguard |
| Strikers on 22:51 - Feb 20 by Northernr |
But again, not to be a dick, but can you name a striker or attacker that moved in January within our budget who's doing well? West Brom spent Ā£8m on Dike - injured. Boro committed Ā£3m to loaning Balogen - most of their fans think Whatmore is better.
Who are these strikers kicking around for us? Where are they? |
My take on the three is that Dykes is entirely a confidence player and his confidence seems fragile at best. Austin is willing but no longer able. Gray seems able but not very willing.
And do we know we werenāt actively trying to get one as that seems to be the line trotted out by the ālacking ambitionā brigade?
I think we needed one, a different type, a more subtle striker, but if we couldnāt afford one on our budget then thatās the end of it, isnāt it. |  | | |
| Strikers on 00:18 - Feb 21 with 3106 views | Myke |
| Strikers on 23:26 - Feb 20 by FrankRightguard |
My take on the three is that Dykes is entirely a confidence player and his confidence seems fragile at best. Austin is willing but no longer able. Gray seems able but not very willing.
And do we know we werenāt actively trying to get one as that seems to be the line trotted out by the ālacking ambitionā brigade?
I think we needed one, a different type, a more subtle striker, but if we couldnāt afford one on our budget then thatās the end of it, isnāt it. |
A fair summation of all three. But questions remain on why Charlie has reverted to 'West Brom Charlie'? Why is Gray's 'can't be arsed' attitude tolerated? You (not you specifically, I mean generally) can say all you like about not getting the right service, but you have to make the right runs, like Gray did v West Brom and Cardiff, like Dykes did against Fulham and that doesn't seem to be happening enough from all three. As I said in my OP, Warburton went out to get Gray to give us a different option, to unlock defences , we have our 'fox in the box' guy, our 'rough em up' guy and our 'run in behind' guy. Yet too often none of these options are on. We complain about our defenders passing the ball amongst themselves, but where are the options? Chair and especially Willock are very creative, Hendrick is a 'forward passing' kind of midfielder (like Stef was 12 months ago), but they all need options.
Lovely cross by Moses, lovely finish by Chair, but a year ago it would have been Chaz, gobbling that up. I appreciate that he drew defenders away from Chair, but just strictly from a predatory point of view, he seems to have become less.. I dunno, hungry? Strikers should be desperate to score in every game and I am not seeing that from our front three | | | |
| Strikers on 07:55 - Feb 21 with 2929 views | Harbour |
| Strikers on 21:24 - Feb 20 by essextaxiboy |
A loan striker in Jan was surely within our reach . We could have passed on Hendrick .it may of worked may not , but at least it would hav shook things up . |
I wonder if the injury to Archer screwed things up we had to bring in Marshall to cover. Seems we were not that far off Swansea valuation of Paterson and the difference may have been the dosh spent on Marshall. But having said that I am not sure Paterson would have given us that much does not seem to be lighting up Swans attack since the recall. As a club we are much more prudent on spending given the shit shows at Reading Derby and a few others will be in trouble next season if they donāt go up. So think club strategy is the right one. | | | |
| Strikers on 08:37 - Feb 21 with 2865 views | stevec |
As Clive mentions, at this level itās extremely difficult to find the striker we need. Looking down leading goal scorers in this Division theyāre either unaffordable or into their 30ās.
John Swift looks the most plausible but not an out and out striker, good goals and assists ratio, which would fit the side as we presently play.
League One, weāve seen a few of their top scorers and theyāre not much cop at this level. Also the age factor doesnāt really fit, a fair few into their latter days.
Scott Twine probably the one who might step up but again, not a striker.
I wonder if we may need to go the loan route next season if still in the Championship. Weāve put down a marker this season so might at last be attractive to a top side season loan. |  | | |
| Strikers on 08:53 - Feb 21 with 2845 views | essextaxiboy |
I would give Armstrong a go , in the first team squad at least .
It was put to me on Sat that his confidence could be damaged but we are not fighting relegation , the crowd would be right with him and it may give some experienced strikers a wake up call .
West Brom have just signed Andy Carroll on a six month deal (salary unknown accepted) and injury prone i know but I watched him give Blackburns defence a physical shellacking the other night , He didnt score but a huge handful to deal with . It was the sort of performance that I was expecting Dykes to provide when we signed him .
We are arranging deckchairs on the Titanic just rotating the midfield ... IMO
Edit.. failing that start Grey for the next 5 games straight , Odubajo/Mcallum at LWB and Willock up with Chair ...IMO [Post edited 21 Feb 2022 9:30]
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| Strikers on 09:17 - Feb 21 with 2791 views | kernowhoop |
| Strikers on 17:05 - Feb 20 by Phil_i_P_Daddy |
Couldnāt disagree more with your description of Dykes Iām sorry to say. Iāve yet to see him dominate in the air, out-muscle anyone or hold the ball up/lay it off with any consistency. Unfortunately, I donāt see that heās developing either.
Alas, we canāt compete in the proven goalscorer market and are reliant on finding a diamond in the rough who isnāt too good and gets taken off us by a bigger club half way through the season. |
So, with Sir Alex Ferguson's endorsement, we may have been able to meet the striker challenge for a mere Ā£26 million per annum 
Can anyone see any problem with that?
More seriously, the truth is that the club has already made perfectly reasonable recruitment decisions to give us more goal-scoring potential - Dykes, Austin, Gray. They are each different in style and threat. That gives the manager the chance to set up the team differently and to change tactics during the game. As we are currently in the play-off positions, we should probably acknowledge that the plan is working. | | | |
| Strikers on 09:33 - Feb 21 with 2752 views | essextaxiboy |
| Strikers on 08:37 - Feb 21 by stevec |
As Clive mentions, at this level itās extremely difficult to find the striker we need. Looking down leading goal scorers in this Division theyāre either unaffordable or into their 30ās.
John Swift looks the most plausible but not an out and out striker, good goals and assists ratio, which would fit the side as we presently play.
League One, weāve seen a few of their top scorers and theyāre not much cop at this level. Also the age factor doesnāt really fit, a fair few into their latter days.
Scott Twine probably the one who might step up but again, not a striker.
I wonder if we may need to go the loan route next season if still in the Championship. Weāve put down a marker this season so might at last be attractive to a top side season loan. |
Does it matter if they are in their 30s for a 6 month loan? , this is aside from the develop and sell on plan , its a sticking plaster | | | |
| Strikers on 10:21 - Feb 21 with 2635 views | PhilmyRs |
Whilst I agree the strikers arenāt playing well, I do think thereās a wider point about our pattern of play and it not being one which brings out the best in our frontmen.
If you were playing us, what would you do? Iād look at Austin leading the line and Chair and Willock being tidy creative players behind that like it to feet and facing the opposition as the most likely goal threats. Iād be comfortable Austin wonāt do me for pace and the midfielders rarely run beyond so would demand a high defensive line and squeeze their defence and midfield. How many times were we offside on Saturday? When this happens, youāre then hoping you can ping balls into Austinās feet and play off him a bit but thatās never been, and never will be, his game. Same for Gray. Of the players we have, although not great at it, Dykes is probably the most suitable for the role given his physical presence and mobility.
What does Austin want? Crosses. What does Gray want? Early service, makes decent runs at times often into channels and a quick head up pass ā Hendrick showed he can do it ā sends him away. So, a wider point for me is whether we should be making the strikers we have fit into our current pattern of play or whether thereās a valid argument to say we should now mix it up a bit? Willock and Chair both started to run beyond the front man second half and that really started to open the game up a bit so thatās one option, or would Gray be more useful than the others, especially if we make a conscious effort to play a few early balls in behind to force their line back a bit or at least give them something to think about.
So for me, itās not just the quality of the strikers, itās our pattern of play thatās not making use of their talents. Teams are going to play a high line and press us so letās look at the best option for addressing that. Is it to keep rotating the strikers to see who can do the job best and hope they can improve? Or is it about mixing up our game a bit more ā be it Willock/chair running beyond or putting in early service in the channel for Gray to hunt down so we start playing to their strengths a bit more? | | | |
| Strikers on 10:36 - Feb 21 with 2613 views | Wegerles_Stairs |
| Strikers on 22:51 - Feb 20 by Northernr |
But again, not to be a dick, but can you name a striker or attacker that moved in January within our budget who's doing well? West Brom spent Ā£8m on Dike - injured. Boro committed Ā£3m to loaning Balogen - most of their fans think Whatmore is better.
Who are these strikers kicking around for us? Where are they? |
What about Ladapo? Stoke signed Maja on loan, which would have at least shaken things up and changed things a bit. He had COVID at the weekend but would still have been more threatening on Saturday than Charlie and Grey.
To be fair though, part of our problem at the moment is actually creating chances for the strikers, so I'd have been happy with Paterson coming in, rather than a striker per se. Just seems a real lack of vision to not sign someone to give us some additional impetus for the remainder of the season. [Post edited 21 Feb 2022 10:37]
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| Strikers on 10:45 - Feb 21 with 2594 views | ParkRoyalR |
| Strikers on 10:21 - Feb 21 by PhilmyRs |
Whilst I agree the strikers arenāt playing well, I do think thereās a wider point about our pattern of play and it not being one which brings out the best in our frontmen.
If you were playing us, what would you do? Iād look at Austin leading the line and Chair and Willock being tidy creative players behind that like it to feet and facing the opposition as the most likely goal threats. Iād be comfortable Austin wonāt do me for pace and the midfielders rarely run beyond so would demand a high defensive line and squeeze their defence and midfield. How many times were we offside on Saturday? When this happens, youāre then hoping you can ping balls into Austinās feet and play off him a bit but thatās never been, and never will be, his game. Same for Gray. Of the players we have, although not great at it, Dykes is probably the most suitable for the role given his physical presence and mobility.
What does Austin want? Crosses. What does Gray want? Early service, makes decent runs at times often into channels and a quick head up pass ā Hendrick showed he can do it ā sends him away. So, a wider point for me is whether we should be making the strikers we have fit into our current pattern of play or whether thereās a valid argument to say we should now mix it up a bit? Willock and Chair both started to run beyond the front man second half and that really started to open the game up a bit so thatās one option, or would Gray be more useful than the others, especially if we make a conscious effort to play a few early balls in behind to force their line back a bit or at least give them something to think about.
So for me, itās not just the quality of the strikers, itās our pattern of play thatās not making use of their talents. Teams are going to play a high line and press us so letās look at the best option for addressing that. Is it to keep rotating the strikers to see who can do the job best and hope they can improve? Or is it about mixing up our game a bit more ā be it Willock/chair running beyond or putting in early service in the channel for Gray to hunt down so we start playing to their strengths a bit more? |
Some very valid points and there are numerous reason for recent drop-off in form, including our missing very good chances, but an obvious starting point and common denominator post AFCON could be Chair.
If you look at Dykes 2nd goal versus Reading, Dykes attacks the box as soon as Willock receives the ball, as he knows that cross is coming, and very likely first time.
If you compare Dykes runs in and around the box versus Millwall in the 2nd Half, he made one run one way, ball did'nt come from Chair, then ran another way and Chair still with his head down passed to where Dykes was previously running, too late, too slow and the opportunity was lost.
This is not to scape-goat Chair, as its difficult to leave him out of the side, given his ball retention and shooting ability, but other than his pass outside to an over-lapping Wallace, we need much more by way of first time passing and assists from the other of our 10's.
I always thought I'd hate to play Centre Forward with BOS on the wing (as you / and he, just never knew what he would do next) and I think similar with Chair as its similar, head-down, 1 touch, 2 touch, 3 touch and by the time the ball is played in, you have either now run offside, given up, or the defence has had time to re-set in 2 banks of 4 and the opportunity has gone.
Willock on the other hand, must be a Centre Forward's dream to play alongside. | | | |
| Strikers on 11:27 - Feb 21 with 2475 views | ngbqpr |
We're third top scorers in the League.
Defensively, only PNE in 12th have conceded more (and that just one). | |
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| Strikers on 11:28 - Feb 21 with 2473 views | LowerloftLad |
Dykes is definitely a confidence player, he is only one goal off double figures for the second season running by far out best striker at the club.
Gray- currently has one goal every four games, he Is meant to be this seasoned pro with bags of pace, he doesn't feel me with any confidence when he comes on and I wouldn't be to fussed if he doesn' stay with us.
Austin- looks shot I still feel if we can keep whipping balls into the box he will pop up with a few more goals this season, Do I think he will score enough goals to keep us in the top six "sadly not". |  |
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