| Patriots at Dover 11:00 - Sep 6 with 9015 views | 1983 |
Whats your view on this?
Sad to see its come to this but worse still the government have pushed people's hand on things like this and bigger it will get.
The Irony of Dovers MP "these people are not from here and are wearing masks" |  |
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| Patriots at Dover on 11:31 - Sep 10 with 1105 views | Gwyn737 |
| Patriots at Dover on 09:35 - Sep 10 by 3swan |
You can add this as well.
Far right ,far left, (As everyone as to have a label ) I couldn't care less.
Who do they think they are?
If you're not with us, then you must be against us attitude.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/art |
99% percent of RNLI launches have nothihg to do from migrants.
If that makes you sent them abuse or stop donating, then I reckon you're against me. |  | | |
| Patriots at Dover on 11:49 - Sep 10 with 1080 views | AnotherJohn |
| Patriots at Dover on 11:31 - Sep 10 by Gwyn737 |
99% percent of RNLI launches have nothihg to do from migrants.
If that makes you sent them abuse or stop donating, then I reckon you're against me. |
I noticed the 1% figure given by the CEO. What I wondered though, if one looked at numbers of persons "rescued" at sea by the RNLI and brought to shore, is what % of the total would be migrants. I'd wager that it is way more than 1%, | | | |
| Patriots at Dover on 12:14 - Sep 10 with 1051 views | Scotia |
Roping the RNLI in to this at any level is pretty disgraceful in my opinion. | | | |
| Patriots at Dover on 14:12 - Sep 10 with 974 views | Gwyn737 |
| Patriots at Dover on 11:49 - Sep 10 by AnotherJohn |
I noticed the 1% figure given by the CEO. What I wondered though, if one looked at numbers of persons "rescued" at sea by the RNLI and brought to shore, is what % of the total would be migrants. I'd wager that it is way more than 1%, |
Depends how you define 'rescued at sea I suppose'.
I don't want money taken away from stranded animals either, for example.
There's also a stat that says around 95% of support to those who cross the channel are provided by other agencies - primarily Boardr Force. | | | |
| Patriots at Dover on 16:36 - Sep 10 with 914 views | onehunglow |
| Patriots at Dover on 12:14 - Sep 10 by Scotia |
Roping the RNLI in to this at any level is pretty disgraceful in my opinion. |
True
The RNLI should not be ferrying illegals from dinghies to shore
We live one mile from a very busy lifeboat station
I have former police colleagues who man Hoylake lifeboat | |
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| Patriots at Dover on 17:15 - Sep 10 with 901 views | AnotherJohn |
| Patriots at Dover on 14:12 - Sep 10 by Gwyn737 |
Depends how you define 'rescued at sea I suppose'.
I don't want money taken away from stranded animals either, for example.
There's also a stat that says around 95% of support to those who cross the channel are provided by other agencies - primarily Boardr Force. |
Sorry, I downvoted Gwyn's post by accident. I just meant to suggest that if the contribution is really 1% or even 5% then the RNLI could cease migrant transport activities without that making much difference. [Post edited 10 Sep 17:17]
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| Patriots at Dover on 17:28 - Sep 10 with 887 views | Gwyn737 |
| Patriots at Dover on 17:15 - Sep 10 by AnotherJohn |
Sorry, I downvoted Gwyn's post by accident. I just meant to suggest that if the contribution is really 1% or even 5% then the RNLI could cease migrant transport activities without that making much difference. [Post edited 10 Sep 17:17]
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Don’t worry, I didn’t notice! 🤣
I’m not sue I know what you mean. Isn’t the figure 1% of RNLI launches not 1% of migrant crossings? | | | |
| Patriots at Dover on 17:42 - Sep 10 with 889 views | AnotherJohn |
| Patriots at Dover on 17:28 - Sep 10 by Gwyn737 |
Don’t worry, I didn’t notice! 🤣
I’m not sue I know what you mean. Isn’t the figure 1% of RNLI launches not 1% of migrant crossings? |
What I am suggesting is that if only 1% of RNLI launches are migrant related then the organisation could say that, taking account of its limited involvement and the negative reputational (and probably financial) consequences for the organisation, it will cease assisting in migrant transport via any pre-arranged rendezvous with French vessels. | | | |
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| Patriots at Dover on 17:55 - Sep 10 with 875 views | Gwyn737 |
| Patriots at Dover on 17:42 - Sep 10 by AnotherJohn |
What I am suggesting is that if only 1% of RNLI launches are migrant related then the organisation could say that, taking account of its limited involvement and the negative reputational (and probably financial) consequences for the organisation, it will cease assisting in migrant transport via any pre-arranged rendezvous with French vessels. |
That would be a big cultural change for them.
It also looked their funding has been driven up. | | | |
| Patriots at Dover on 18:32 - Sep 10 with 862 views | JJBomber |
No point the Patriots being at Dover. They need to be at the ballot box at the next election! | | | |
| Patriots at Dover on 19:34 - Sep 10 with 844 views | Scotia |
| Patriots at Dover on 17:55 - Sep 10 by Gwyn737 |
That would be a big cultural change for them.
It also looked their funding has been driven up. |
And probably lead to deaths. I'd bet retrieving individual bodies from the beaches and coasts of southern England would use up a lot more resource, without even considering the loss of human life. | | | |
| Patriots at Dover on 19:38 - Sep 10 with 840 views | JACKMANANDBOY |
| Patriots at Dover on 17:55 - Sep 10 by Gwyn737 |
That would be a big cultural change for them.
It also looked their funding has been driven up. |
The French don't pick them up because they say it's too dangerous, we should just turn them around and take them back to France. It's obviously too dangerous for the French to disagree. |  |
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| Patriots at Dover on 20:00 - Sep 10 with 827 views | Scotia |
| Patriots at Dover on 19:38 - Sep 10 by JACKMANANDBOY |
The French don't pick them up because they say it's too dangerous, we should just turn them around and take them back to France. It's obviously too dangerous for the French to disagree. |
We can't do that though, and we cant change international maritime law so we won't be able to in the future, unless we get France to agree to take them back. | | | |
| Patriots at Dover on 20:11 - Sep 10 with 821 views | max936 |
| Patriots at Dover on 20:00 - Sep 10 by Scotia |
We can't do that though, and we cant change international maritime law so we won't be able to in the future, unless we get France to agree to take them back. |
Let them all come and let the taxpayer pay for them all plus the social security system and the taxpayers can work until they drop dead, cause they don't want pensioners who are and will claim their state pensions and they don't want people saving or having private pensions, or inheriting money or property cause they want the lions share of it all to pay for all of the above.
The 14yrs of the Tory party was bad, but this lot are taking bad to a far far higher level, they don't care about Britain and certainly not the British people, that's plain to see, for those that can see it, of course. |  | | |
| Patriots at Dover on 20:22 - Sep 10 with 811 views | Scotia |
| Patriots at Dover on 20:11 - Sep 10 by max936 |
Let them all come and let the taxpayer pay for them all plus the social security system and the taxpayers can work until they drop dead, cause they don't want pensioners who are and will claim their state pensions and they don't want people saving or having private pensions, or inheriting money or property cause they want the lions share of it all to pay for all of the above.
The 14yrs of the Tory party was bad, but this lot are taking bad to a far far higher level, they don't care about Britain and certainly not the British people, that's plain to see, for those that can see it, of course. |
This lot are taking to a new level. A better one if you want to see a reduction in so called illegal immigration.
We need some honesty in politics, but I don't think you'd like it. | | | |
| Patriots at Dover on 20:24 - Sep 10 with 810 views | blackswan |
Home secretary telling police to use all powers necessary on anti migrant protests!
Looks like free speech and the right to protest peacefully only applies if you follow their narrative | | | |
| Patriots at Dover on 21:44 - Sep 10 with 773 views | AnotherJohn |
| Patriots at Dover on 20:00 - Sep 10 by Scotia |
We can't do that though, and we cant change international maritime law so we won't be able to in the future, unless we get France to agree to take them back. |
As I have mentioned on a few threads, there are only a few areas in the Channel where a boat leaving French territorial waters moves immediately into British territorial waters; the boats pass through international waters in the middle, especially on a 70 mile trip from Utah Beach to the beach close to Portsmouth. If a British boat picked up migrants just outside French territorial waters (which end 11 nautical miles from Utah Beach) and conveyed them to the nearest safe port - which would be a French port - how would that contravene international law? No doubts some immigration lawyers would spin a different line but this seems an arguable case to me. | | | |
| Patriots at Dover on 22:09 - Sep 10 with 763 views | Scotia |
| Patriots at Dover on 21:44 - Sep 10 by AnotherJohn |
As I have mentioned on a few threads, there are only a few areas in the Channel where a boat leaving French territorial waters moves immediately into British territorial waters; the boats pass through international waters in the middle, especially on a 70 mile trip from Utah Beach to the beach close to Portsmouth. If a British boat picked up migrants just outside French territorial waters (which end 11 nautical miles from Utah Beach) and conveyed them to the nearest safe port - which would be a French port - how would that contravene international law? No doubts some immigration lawyers would spin a different line but this seems an arguable case to me. |
That boat may not be in immediate distress and need rescuing, they may refuse assistance and carry on chugging their way across the channel. It may be overcrowded and dangerous, but that makes unwarranted attempts to rescue even more dangerous. That's where the french "shepherding" them comes from. They're making sure if anyone falls out they're rescued before they drown.
You have to want to be rescued, if you've given every penny you've ever had to a smuggler to get you to Britain you aren't going to get on a french boat 25% of the way to the UK.
As I understand the boat that rescues people in international waters has to take them to the nation of the flag that boat sails under unless there's an immediate risk to life.
And that's before lawyers started to ask for proof of where they departed from. | | | |
| Patriots at Dover on 22:24 - Sep 10 with 753 views | Boundy |
| Patriots at Dover on 19:34 - Sep 10 by Scotia |
And probably lead to deaths. I'd bet retrieving individual bodies from the beaches and coasts of southern England would use up a lot more resource, without even considering the loss of human life. |
Ever heard of responsibility for your own actions , no one asked for these people to come here , and the bollocks of fleeing wars has run out of steam . | |
| "In a free society, the State is the servant of the people—not the master." |
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| Patriots at Dover on 22:27 - Sep 10 with 751 views | Scotia |
| Patriots at Dover on 22:24 - Sep 10 by Boundy |
Ever heard of responsibility for your own actions , no one asked for these people to come here , and the bollocks of fleeing wars has run out of steam . |
Tell that to someone who gets caught in a rip current surfing or blown out to sea on a paddle board.
It's the facts. I'm sorry you don't like it but Nigel isn't going to change them. | | | |
| Patriots at Dover on 22:59 - Sep 10 with 741 views | Boundy |
| Patriots at Dover on 22:27 - Sep 10 by Scotia |
Tell that to someone who gets caught in a rip current surfing or blown out to sea on a paddle board.
It's the facts. I'm sorry you don't like it but Nigel isn't going to change them. |
We're talking about illegals here not some ten year old on an inflatable flemingo , if they want to chance their arm thats their choice , personnally after reading about a 14 year boy getting raped by one of these pigs I'm at the point of not caring wtf happens to them as long as they stay away from this country . | |
| "In a free society, the State is the servant of the people—not the master." |
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| Patriots at Dover on 06:29 - Sep 11 with 670 views | AnotherJohn |
| Patriots at Dover on 22:09 - Sep 10 by Scotia |
That boat may not be in immediate distress and need rescuing, they may refuse assistance and carry on chugging their way across the channel. It may be overcrowded and dangerous, but that makes unwarranted attempts to rescue even more dangerous. That's where the french "shepherding" them comes from. They're making sure if anyone falls out they're rescued before they drown.
You have to want to be rescued, if you've given every penny you've ever had to a smuggler to get you to Britain you aren't going to get on a french boat 25% of the way to the UK.
As I understand the boat that rescues people in international waters has to take them to the nation of the flag that boat sails under unless there's an immediate risk to life.
And that's before lawyers started to ask for proof of where they departed from. |
"As I understand the boat that rescues people in international waters has to take them to the nation of the flag that boat sails under unless there's an immediate risk to life."
No, that is incorrect. Neither return to the “flag state” nor rescuing vessel's home country is required by the SOLAS or SAR Conventions. The legal obligation is to rescue and then arrange prompt transfer to an appropriate place of safety, with relevant States cooperating to facilitate this. Easy enough to check on AI if you are unsure. The arguments would be about whether the French could deny disembarkation , but if their ports are nearer to the rescue that could be contested and they could be criticised for blocking access to a safe port.
As to whether the boat could decline rescue, a relevant point is that most do not have sufficient fuel for the whole trip - just a roughly midway position in the Channel - not even that in the Portsmouth case. A boat drifting in the Channel with women and children aboard wouldn't have much choice. | | | |
| Patriots at Dover on 08:18 - Sep 11 with 642 views | Scotia |
| Patriots at Dover on 06:29 - Sep 11 by AnotherJohn |
"As I understand the boat that rescues people in international waters has to take them to the nation of the flag that boat sails under unless there's an immediate risk to life."
No, that is incorrect. Neither return to the “flag state” nor rescuing vessel's home country is required by the SOLAS or SAR Conventions. The legal obligation is to rescue and then arrange prompt transfer to an appropriate place of safety, with relevant States cooperating to facilitate this. Easy enough to check on AI if you are unsure. The arguments would be about whether the French could deny disembarkation , but if their ports are nearer to the rescue that could be contested and they could be criticised for blocking access to a safe port.
As to whether the boat could decline rescue, a relevant point is that most do not have sufficient fuel for the whole trip - just a roughly midway position in the Channel - not even that in the Portsmouth case. A boat drifting in the Channel with women and children aboard wouldn't have much choice. |
But all they've got to do is get half way, on an incoming tide that would be easy, and a boat could easily carry more fuel.
We're splitting hairs here, the bottom line is once the migrants have left a French beach stopping them arriving here is incredibly difficult. It's a waste of time focusing on that as a method of reducing "illegal" arrivals.
An blaming the RNLI is completely out of order on any level. | | | |
| Patriots at Dover on 08:41 - Sep 11 with 629 views | AnotherJohn |
| Patriots at Dover on 08:18 - Sep 11 by Scotia |
But all they've got to do is get half way, on an incoming tide that would be easy, and a boat could easily carry more fuel.
We're splitting hairs here, the bottom line is once the migrants have left a French beach stopping them arriving here is incredibly difficult. It's a waste of time focusing on that as a method of reducing "illegal" arrivals.
An blaming the RNLI is completely out of order on any level. |
If the French did nothing and their vessels stayed in port, I still don't see what would prevent our vessels returning migrants once they got into international waters. There are even precedents when Border Force and RNLI vessels were allowed by the French to return migrants to France from French waters in incidents where they asked for British help in July 2024 and August 2026.
https://www.bbc.com/news/artic | | | |
| Patriots at Dover on 20:18 - Sep 14 with 441 views | Scotia |
| Patriots at Dover on 08:41 - Sep 11 by AnotherJohn |
If the French did nothing and their vessels stayed in port, I still don't see what would prevent our vessels returning migrants once they got into international waters. There are even precedents when Border Force and RNLI vessels were allowed by the French to return migrants to France from French waters in incidents where they asked for British help in July 2024 and August 2026.
https://www.bbc.com/news/artic |
If France allowed us to return them then we could, but to get that permission will take a huge diplomatic effort and probably cost a wedge.
France don't want them and they don't want to be in France | | | |
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