| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) 00:01 - Dec 10 with 8277 views | stainrods_elbow |
Anyone experienced/experiencing this?
What/who did you blame (if anyone)?
How did you handle it?
Did you falll back in?
Is it me getting older and emptier, or am I deluded that the game's just not what was, we fans are an irrelevance/encumbrance (Hillsborough, Paris, Qatar - though some of whom are also tw*ts, which doens't help)?
Answers to my therapist!
[Post edited 10 Dec 2022 0:08]
|  |
| |  |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 13:29 - Dec 10 with 2024 views | terryb |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 10:10 - Dec 10 by HuckerMOTM |
The 'Good Old Days' were far better.
It was an affordable pastime and you didn't need to buy tickets months in advance to see most matches but simply turn up at the gate.
The hooligan issue was present but is now significantly blown out of all proportion. It wasn't half as bad as people who werent there make out.
Homophobia? Wasn't even discussed because everyone knew that it wasn't an issue, it's something which has retrospectively been thrown at the game by people who weren't there.
Racism, clearly better now but watch The Big Match replay consistently and, again, it becomes obvious quite quickly that it is something which has subsequently been blown out of proportion and those 'ever present monkey chants' were seldom heard on the terraces. Idiots will always be Idiots and there's not a lot less now than the mid 80s.
Finally, in the 1980s Nottingham Forest and Aston Villa won the European Cup.
Ipswich Town won the UEFA Cup.
Oxford and Luton won the League Cup.
Wimbledon and Coventry City won the FA Cup.
QPR, Southampton, Watford, Brighton and Oldham came close to winning major honours....
Don't tell me it's looking back thorough nostalgic tinged glasses... [Post edited 10 Dec 2022 10:11]
|
Football was certainly more affordable & easier to attend. No dispute there & the Cups in the 80's were shared around more than now.
However, that didn't apply to the Football League. Aston Villa were the only club to be champions outside of the "big 5" in the 80's - Liverpool 6, Everton 2 & Arsenal. 7 of the FA Cups were also won by the "5" (Liverpool, Everton, Manchester United, Tottenham & Arsenal).
This is all similar to the 2010's! One winner of The Premiership outside the current top 6 (Chelsea & Manchester City replacing Everton), the same as the '80's. Only Wigan were outsiders to win FA cup in the decade, but the following all appeared in other finals:- Portsmouth, Stoke, Hull, Aston Villa, Crystal Palace & Watford. That is quite a spread.
Homophobia wasn't discussed? Of course it wasn't, but it would have existed! Players & supporters were far too scared to do anything but play a masculine roll. The first player that I can recall declaring his homosexuality took his own life due to the abuse he was treated to.
Football has many faults now, but it has had faults of one kind or another throughout my lifetime. Probably some things were better in the past, but some were worse. [Post edited 10 Dec 2022 13:40]
|  | | |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 17:22 - Dec 10 with 1904 views | HuckerMOTM |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 13:29 - Dec 10 by terryb |
Football was certainly more affordable & easier to attend. No dispute there & the Cups in the 80's were shared around more than now.
However, that didn't apply to the Football League. Aston Villa were the only club to be champions outside of the "big 5" in the 80's - Liverpool 6, Everton 2 & Arsenal. 7 of the FA Cups were also won by the "5" (Liverpool, Everton, Manchester United, Tottenham & Arsenal).
This is all similar to the 2010's! One winner of The Premiership outside the current top 6 (Chelsea & Manchester City replacing Everton), the same as the '80's. Only Wigan were outsiders to win FA cup in the decade, but the following all appeared in other finals:- Portsmouth, Stoke, Hull, Aston Villa, Crystal Palace & Watford. That is quite a spread.
Homophobia wasn't discussed? Of course it wasn't, but it would have existed! Players & supporters were far too scared to do anything but play a masculine roll. The first player that I can recall declaring his homosexuality took his own life due to the abuse he was treated to.
Football has many faults now, but it has had faults of one kind or another throughout my lifetime. Probably some things were better in the past, but some were worse. [Post edited 10 Dec 2022 13:40]
|
Justin Fashanu took his life because he felt ashamed being gay - its why he had a drink problem too - and because he was facing rape charges.
His career had been effectively over since 1987- 3 years before he came out - and he hardly played after that year.
All this nonsense that he was subjected to horrendous abuse by fans is made up. The Fashanu who got the abuse after Justin came out was John and that was a couple of seasons of people occasionally camply going 'coo-eee' when he touched the ball but that had stopped by 1992.
The reality is that people assume that there must have been rampant homophobia in football in the 80s because it was still a working class male sport but the truth is very different. Most people didn't and still don't care what you do with consenting adults in your bedroom. [Post edited 10 Dec 2022 17:23]
| | | |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 17:47 - Dec 10 with 1868 views | stainrods_elbow |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 17:22 - Dec 10 by HuckerMOTM |
Justin Fashanu took his life because he felt ashamed being gay - its why he had a drink problem too - and because he was facing rape charges.
His career had been effectively over since 1987- 3 years before he came out - and he hardly played after that year.
All this nonsense that he was subjected to horrendous abuse by fans is made up. The Fashanu who got the abuse after Justin came out was John and that was a couple of seasons of people occasionally camply going 'coo-eee' when he touched the ball but that had stopped by 1992.
The reality is that people assume that there must have been rampant homophobia in football in the 80s because it was still a working class male sport but the truth is very different. Most people didn't and still don't care what you do with consenting adults in your bedroom. [Post edited 10 Dec 2022 17:23]
|
How do you know all the machinations of Fashanu's suicide? But even if you're right (you're not) that homophobia in football in the 1970s/1980s is over-stated in hindsight, even on your own terms your analysis doesn't add up - if he was 'ashamed', how do you think that shame was implanted in him if not by others? Fashanu had a manager in Brian Clough who was openly homphobic and mocked him for his (gay) clubbing, as was widely reported, while his obnoxious and probably corrupt thug brother John ran him down in public and said he was disgusted by him. As for the rape charges, he denied these, but felt any trial would have been prejudiced by his homsexuality. Justin clearly had his faults and probably too much went to his head when he was doing well, but to pass off professional and family dynamics like that as though they were trifling is just irresponsible. [Post edited 10 Dec 2022 17:48]
| |
| |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 17:49 - Dec 10 with 1866 views | stainrods_elbow |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 01:02 - Dec 10 by PunteR |
Nice try Elbow. |
Eh? | |
| |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 23:19 - Dec 10 with 1774 views | PunteR |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 17:49 - Dec 10 by stainrods_elbow |
Eh? |
Isn't this thread just another opportunity for you to run the club down again? |  |
| Occasional providers of half decent House music. |
| |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 23:48 - Dec 10 with 1757 views | essextaxiboy |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 09:51 - Dec 10 by HuckerMOTM |
Really random, but I think we met whilst queuing for a burger at Wealdstone before the friendly unless there's more Billericay Rangers out there! |
IThat was me . I remember us meeting . . I live in Wickford but Billericay is my closest non league . , |  | | |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 01:55 - Dec 11 with 1731 views | stainrods_elbow |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 23:19 - Dec 10 by PunteR |
Isn't this thread just another opportunity for you to run the club down again? |
O go to bed - I'm tallking about my changing feeling for QPR/football over a half-century. Come and talk to me when you've acquired a similar depth! [Post edited 11 Dec 2022 1:56]
| |
| |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 09:59 - Dec 11 with 1647 views | PunteR |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 01:55 - Dec 11 by stainrods_elbow |
O go to bed - I'm tallking about my changing feeling for QPR/football over a half-century. Come and talk to me when you've acquired a similar depth! [Post edited 11 Dec 2022 1:56]
|
Your changing feeling towards QPR?. You've spent most your time on here slating the club so this thread should be called the ' No shit Sherlock I've fallen out of love with QPR/football'.
You just seem to be trying to drum up a pitchfork invasion towards the board when we're sitting in sixth place with a half decent team. I'm not saying the board shouldn't be held accountable for how the club is run and I do share some of your concerns and I've also been publicly critical on here. I just think your timing is wrong and this thread has more to do with you trying to justify yourself after your slightly embarrassing poll thread.
Is that deep enough for you.?
I do get what you're saying about football in general though. | |
| Occasional providers of half decent House music. |
| |
Login to get fewer ads
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 10:12 - Dec 11 with 1626 views | HuckerMOTM |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 17:47 - Dec 10 by stainrods_elbow |
How do you know all the machinations of Fashanu's suicide? But even if you're right (you're not) that homophobia in football in the 1970s/1980s is over-stated in hindsight, even on your own terms your analysis doesn't add up - if he was 'ashamed', how do you think that shame was implanted in him if not by others? Fashanu had a manager in Brian Clough who was openly homphobic and mocked him for his (gay) clubbing, as was widely reported, while his obnoxious and probably corrupt thug brother John ran him down in public and said he was disgusted by him. As for the rape charges, he denied these, but felt any trial would have been prejudiced by his homsexuality. Justin clearly had his faults and probably too much went to his head when he was doing well, but to pass off professional and family dynamics like that as though they were trifling is just irresponsible. [Post edited 10 Dec 2022 17:48]
|
His suicide note was published so we know all the details.
His shame at being gay came not from football culture but from his Christian beliefs being at odds with his homosexuality.
Also, there are witnesses who have confirmed that Clough only asked him why he hung around at 'Poof pubs' (not the derogatory term it now is but just a phase) but never once taunted him for being gay because Justin didn't tell anyone he was and used to 'hang out' with women to hide the fact.
As for any future trial being affected by his sexuality, that's pure conjecture, of course, but if you're on trial, as a man, for the rape of a man there will be questions asked. | | | |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 11:29 - Dec 11 with 1580 views | Damo1962 |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 10:10 - Dec 10 by HuckerMOTM |
The 'Good Old Days' were far better.
It was an affordable pastime and you didn't need to buy tickets months in advance to see most matches but simply turn up at the gate.
The hooligan issue was present but is now significantly blown out of all proportion. It wasn't half as bad as people who werent there make out.
Homophobia? Wasn't even discussed because everyone knew that it wasn't an issue, it's something which has retrospectively been thrown at the game by people who weren't there.
Racism, clearly better now but watch The Big Match replay consistently and, again, it becomes obvious quite quickly that it is something which has subsequently been blown out of proportion and those 'ever present monkey chants' were seldom heard on the terraces. Idiots will always be Idiots and there's not a lot less now than the mid 80s.
Finally, in the 1980s Nottingham Forest and Aston Villa won the European Cup.
Ipswich Town won the UEFA Cup.
Oxford and Luton won the League Cup.
Wimbledon and Coventry City won the FA Cup.
QPR, Southampton, Watford, Brighton and Oldham came close to winning major honours....
Don't tell me it's looking back thorough nostalgic tinged glasses... [Post edited 10 Dec 2022 10:11]
|
You express my thoughts perfectly. I actually find watching football (even Rangers)...boring nowadays. Can't remember the last match I watched from beginning to end. Prefer just to follow the results now if I'm honest. As a lot of others say, age and what's left of life, do focus the mind on other things. I'll still be as happy as a "Pig in shite"...if we beat Burnley today though. | | | |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 21:53 - Dec 11 with 1460 views | stainrods_elbow |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 10:12 - Dec 11 by HuckerMOTM |
His suicide note was published so we know all the details.
His shame at being gay came not from football culture but from his Christian beliefs being at odds with his homosexuality.
Also, there are witnesses who have confirmed that Clough only asked him why he hung around at 'Poof pubs' (not the derogatory term it now is but just a phase) but never once taunted him for being gay because Justin didn't tell anyone he was and used to 'hang out' with women to hide the fact.
As for any future trial being affected by his sexuality, that's pure conjecture, of course, but if you're on trial, as a man, for the rape of a man there will be questions asked. |
I'm not sure how conflicted Fashanu was about his sexuality, or what role, if any, it played in his suicide. He gave interviews long before his death, including one with Clive Anderson in 1992, when he discussed the Sun's splash in a relaxed and accepting way.
I don;t think there's any doubt that Clough's attitude to Fashanu, and to his sexuality, was damaging, derogratory and is one of a numbe rof things about Clough's personality and career that leave a nasty taste. The topic has also been well aired in the (auto) biographies.
Finally, a trial to ascertain if a man was raped (whon Fashanu accused of making a mischievous complaint, having demanded and been refused money) is just that. Of course, we'll now never know what, if anything, happened. | |
| |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 21:58 - Dec 11 with 1455 views | stainrods_elbow |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 09:59 - Dec 11 by PunteR |
Your changing feeling towards QPR?. You've spent most your time on here slating the club so this thread should be called the ' No shit Sherlock I've fallen out of love with QPR/football'.
You just seem to be trying to drum up a pitchfork invasion towards the board when we're sitting in sixth place with a half decent team. I'm not saying the board shouldn't be held accountable for how the club is run and I do share some of your concerns and I've also been publicly critical on here. I just think your timing is wrong and this thread has more to do with you trying to justify yourself after your slightly embarrassing poll thread.
Is that deep enough for you.?
I do get what you're saying about football in general though. |
Thanks a lot for that (er, I think). I'll come to you in future, shall I, when deciding how to time and title my posts. and you can give me the benefit of your entirely unpatronsing, non-embarrassing advice. If I don't feel embarrassed by, ooer, putting up a poll of all of things (why should I? Plenty of people voted, and I thought it was mainly interesting to see how the result was sesd by some to enhance their smug majoritarianism and derogatory attitude to the minority), I'll sign off any shame as yours. | |
| |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 22:17 - Dec 11 with 1424 views | Logman |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 21:58 - Dec 11 by stainrods_elbow |
Thanks a lot for that (er, I think). I'll come to you in future, shall I, when deciding how to time and title my posts. and you can give me the benefit of your entirely unpatronsing, non-embarrassing advice. If I don't feel embarrassed by, ooer, putting up a poll of all of things (why should I? Plenty of people voted, and I thought it was mainly interesting to see how the result was sesd by some to enhance their smug majoritarianism and derogatory attitude to the minority), I'll sign off any shame as yours. |
Just out of interest, stainrod's elbow, is there anything qpr related at all which warms your cockles and you take pleasure in ? I don't think I've ever seen a message from you which praises anything about the club which I find quite bizarre given that it is something which I presume you follow as a leisure pursuit ? | | | |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 22:21 - Dec 11 with 1418 views | Konk |
If there was no homophobia in football in the 80’s then what would you call opposition fans against Watford regularly singing, “Elton John is a homosexual” and “He’s short, he’s bent, his arse is up for rent, Elton John, Elton John!”. And Justin Fashanu got loads of homophobic abuse when he played at Fulham, for example.
Lots of stuff was better about the game in the 80’s - most of it money-related - but crowds were s hit almost everywhere and that was in no small part to do with the violence around the game. [Post edited 11 Dec 2022 22:34]
|  |
| Fulham FC: It's the taking part that counts |
| |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 00:16 - Dec 12 with 1385 views | PunteR |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 21:58 - Dec 11 by stainrods_elbow |
Thanks a lot for that (er, I think). I'll come to you in future, shall I, when deciding how to time and title my posts. and you can give me the benefit of your entirely unpatronsing, non-embarrassing advice. If I don't feel embarrassed by, ooer, putting up a poll of all of things (why should I? Plenty of people voted, and I thought it was mainly interesting to see how the result was sesd by some to enhance their smug majoritarianism and derogatory attitude to the minority), I'll sign off any shame as yours. |
You asked.
And saying to me "Come and talk to me when you've acquired a similar depth!" isn't patronising.? [Post edited 12 Dec 2022 0:33]
| |
| Occasional providers of half decent House music. |
| |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 09:45 - Dec 12 with 1289 views | Toast_R |
I wonder if the World Cup hangover will effect attendances over the next few weeks. I had to force myself to watch that sh*t show yesterday and wasn't interested particularly mainy because I knew what was coming. The last month or so as a QPR has been tough with the team in poor form and the manager walking out so we're back to square one. The World cup has ended in disappointment again in frustrating fashion and QPR less than 24 hours later got trounced in a performance that stank of relegation. We then appoint a new manager that the majority of us have no clue about and there's no money to spend. Sell it to me? [Post edited 12 Dec 2022 9:49]
|  | | |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 10:02 - Dec 12 with 1250 views | kernowhoop |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 09:45 - Dec 12 by Toast_R |
I wonder if the World Cup hangover will effect attendances over the next few weeks. I had to force myself to watch that sh*t show yesterday and wasn't interested particularly mainy because I knew what was coming. The last month or so as a QPR has been tough with the team in poor form and the manager walking out so we're back to square one. The World cup has ended in disappointment again in frustrating fashion and QPR less than 24 hours later got trounced in a performance that stank of relegation. We then appoint a new manager that the majority of us have no clue about and there's no money to spend. Sell it to me? [Post edited 12 Dec 2022 9:49]
|
Sell it to you, Toast?
First, you could check back on this board and look at the comments when we were having the run that took us to the top of the league.
If that does not help, then simply consider whether the whole point of being a fan of a football club is to have your emotions played with - the highs and the lows - in a part of life that, unlike many other things, does not really matter. | | | |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 10:16 - Dec 12 with 1239 views | Toast_R |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 10:02 - Dec 12 by kernowhoop |
Sell it to you, Toast?
First, you could check back on this board and look at the comments when we were having the run that took us to the top of the league.
If that does not help, then simply consider whether the whole point of being a fan of a football club is to have your emotions played with - the highs and the lows - in a part of life that, unlike many other things, does not really matter. |
Sorry I should have put its a hard sell rather than sell it me. Add in the bloody train strikes an it makes it even harder to follow.
Down in the dumps mate, thats all. I'm sure we win our next game, Chair comes back raring to go and it might seem rosey again. | | | |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 10:18 - Dec 12 with 1234 views | Rangers67 |
I was one of the hardy few who bothered to get out of a nice warm house and schlep down to HQ for that horror show. I to feel slightly disconnected from football in general now ( not QPR ). i think football has been badly affected by the vast amounts of money pumped into the game. I didn,t bother watching the world cup much as the whole charade of it being a genuine tournament was to much for me to swallow along with the attitude of FIFA and the organisers to the workers and peoples human rights.
The game in general has been ruined by the Premier league and the FA . Take yesterdays game for example. There is no doubt Burnley were streets ahead of us in every way and deservedly won. But the referee , supposedly a premier league official really helped them both by his ineptitude and because Burnley knew exactly how to play him, falling over at the slightest touch as if they were dying and then 20 seconds later up and running around, typical premier league behaviour. If he gets more than a 3 in the match report I will be surprised. Along with the farcial refereeing performance from the ref in the England game the night before , i have to admit I only watched the highlights but have read a few reports but when you get officials with either an agenda or have had their ear bent by FIFA as to which teams they want to progress then you know the game has gone down the pan. | | | |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 10:28 - Dec 12 with 1214 views | Sonofpugwash |
VAR Humbug! |  |
| |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 11:46 - Dec 12 with 1159 views | kernowhoop |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 10:16 - Dec 12 by Toast_R |
Sorry I should have put its a hard sell rather than sell it me. Add in the bloody train strikes an it makes it even harder to follow.
Down in the dumps mate, thats all. I'm sure we win our next game, Chair comes back raring to go and it might seem rosey again. |
Sympathy. I get all of that! | | | |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 19:52 - Dec 12 with 1036 views | stainrods_elbow |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 22:17 - Dec 11 by Logman |
Just out of interest, stainrod's elbow, is there anything qpr related at all which warms your cockles and you take pleasure in ? I don't think I've ever seen a message from you which praises anything about the club which I find quite bizarre given that it is something which I presume you follow as a leisure pursuit ? |
See the title of this thread. My love for QPR is, at best, a curdling (dis)pleasure. Probably 'love hate' would be the best way to sum it up these days, and, as Chrissie Hynde once sang, there's a thin (white) line between the two. | |
| |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 21:25 - Dec 12 with 990 views | paulparker |
Maybe it’s me getting old but I find it hard to get interested in the game these days
I was football daft as a lad , played for the school, club, and the local county , if a game was on I was there or I would be glued to the box , even as a kid I would stay up late for midweek sport special , going to QPR was the ultimate for me
I hate it now modern football has become to political, with to much drama off the pitch , add plastic fans stupid kick off times , inane commentary and VAR i really don’t know who the game is aimed at these days , especially for club sides, I don’t recognise who they are what they represent now , its all greed , Amazon buying Man Utd , Saudi oil money, Russian gun money it makes me sick
My interest always returns for England and a tournament that’s the only time I’ve been nervous before a game in a long time the other night
This week I got rid of SKY & BT and it felt great to tell them to do one
As for Rangers well I still like going but that’s only to meet up with some great people off here and have a number of beers
A lot of love I had for the club died after our second relegation under uncle Tony’s reign of terror
We got it so right with Warnock and got all Bertie big potatoes and fcuked it
It wasn’t the club I loved and that love hasn’t really comeback TBH
I even turned the game off yesterday at half time and watched a Christmas film instead |  |
| And Bowles is onside, Swinburne has come rushing out of his goal , what can Bowles do here , onto the left foot no, on to the right foot
That’s there that’s two, and that’s Bowles
Brian Moore
|
| |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 21:42 - Dec 12 with 970 views | Damo1962 |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 21:25 - Dec 12 by paulparker |
Maybe it’s me getting old but I find it hard to get interested in the game these days
I was football daft as a lad , played for the school, club, and the local county , if a game was on I was there or I would be glued to the box , even as a kid I would stay up late for midweek sport special , going to QPR was the ultimate for me
I hate it now modern football has become to political, with to much drama off the pitch , add plastic fans stupid kick off times , inane commentary and VAR i really don’t know who the game is aimed at these days , especially for club sides, I don’t recognise who they are what they represent now , its all greed , Amazon buying Man Utd , Saudi oil money, Russian gun money it makes me sick
My interest always returns for England and a tournament that’s the only time I’ve been nervous before a game in a long time the other night
This week I got rid of SKY & BT and it felt great to tell them to do one
As for Rangers well I still like going but that’s only to meet up with some great people off here and have a number of beers
A lot of love I had for the club died after our second relegation under uncle Tony’s reign of terror
We got it so right with Warnock and got all Bertie big potatoes and fcuked it
It wasn’t the club I loved and that love hasn’t really comeback TBH
I even turned the game off yesterday at half time and watched a Christmas film instead |
Feel exactly the same fella. I just turned 60, and so many other things are more important to me than football...even QPR. But it still hurts when we lose, and feels great when we win - though neither emotion last as long as they once did. QPR are in my blood, and will be forever. Football itself...meh! 🤔 | | | |
| On falling out of love with QPR (and pro football) on 22:48 - Dec 12 with 927 views | GloryHunter |
I've never felt more like giving it up than now. Didn't renew my ST this season because of the fiasco of losing Warbs, after the late-season collapse. Plus I can't see the action at the school end of the pitch because of the stupid LED perimeter hoarding ads. Tried a game in SARd but couldn't fit my legs in the seat. Then the PBBC fiasco. Then England losing to France. After 55 years I have found myself envying people who do not invest their mental wellbeing in supporting a football team. |  | | |
| |
By continuing to use the site, you agree to our use of cookies and to abide by our Terms and Conditions.
