| Whingeing 17:34 - Apr 22 with 8242 views | dutch |
There were some people on here at half time who should be ashamed at themselves. Complaining when we're drawing 0-0 away at the best team in the division in a game of that importance. Quoting possession stats and moaning because we're not playing like Barcelona. After a terrible run when we have usually been 1-0 down within ten minutes I was super pleased with that and actually thought we could just go on and nick it. Did you moan at Wembley on Bobby Zamora day, which was like Rourke's drift? When we see commitment, determination, people putting bodies on the line to make blocks bloody well applaud it. Great win today, just wish I'd been one of the lucky 500 |  | | |  |
| Whingeing on 15:08 - Apr 23 with 1255 views | Antti_Heinola |
| Whingeing on 22:19 - Apr 22 by VancouverHoop |
Football isn't played on graph paper though. Ainsworth fundamentally believes that and said as much in his post-match interview. He knew we weren't going to be able to go toe-to-toe with Burnley so had to find another way. He did. It worked. |
It did but 'fundamentally' if that first half happens 20 times a season you lose 19 times. |  |
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| Whingeing on 15:30 - Apr 23 with 1172 views | distortR |
| Whingeing on 15:02 - Apr 23 by BrianMcCarthy |
Sorry, E15, I don't understand that logic.
Our first-half plan was to intentionally sit back and isolate the front two?
If so, it led to three clearances, one hit crossbar and one missed howler, seventeen shots, twelve inside the box, ten corners. It was a miracle that the game wasn't over by half-time. The tactics Ainsworth put in place at half-time could have been put in place before the game. Fair play to him for adjusting, though. |
Yeah, but apart from the 3 goal line clearances, one hit crossbar and one missed howler, seventeen shots, twelve inside the box, ten corners, well, they hardly laid a finger on us.........   | | | |
| Whingeing on 15:35 - Apr 23 with 1155 views | PinnerPaul |
| Whingeing on 14:34 - Apr 23 by BrianMcCarthy |
Fair and balanced, I think.
We all see games differently, of course, but I thought that first half was worrying from a tactical viewpoint. Playing two up front against a Cryuffian possession-hungry team meant we had two players isolated and unable to contribute, and playing with two deep holding midfielders meant that we were unable to transition the ball to the front two without a link man in between.
I agree with distortR that Ainsworth did well at half-time, pushing us further up the pitch so we could get ball to our forwards and then to retain it slightly better. Laird for Drewe was a huge help, and Armstrong for Adomah gave us an outlet. Without the half-time re-adjustment and without those two subs, it seemed highly likely that we'd have been just as poor in the second half as in the first, and that our luck would hardly hold.
That's how I saw it anyway. FWIW. |
As VK said, he thought they had something to do with it as well.
Yes we all love a hyperbole, BUT whatever we think, they ARE professional players with (compared to 99.9%) great technical ability and they ARE coached to within an inch of their lives.
As VK said "Make it up as you go along" which he says his team did 2nd half, you ARE in trouble because most days a professional team will beat you.
We've seen that so many times ourselves this season after all! | | | |
| Whingeing on 15:38 - Apr 23 with 1126 views | PinnerPaul |
| Whingeing on 15:08 - Apr 23 by Antti_Heinola |
It did but 'fundamentally' if that first half happens 20 times a season you lose 19 times. |
As I keep banging on about though over 46 games you get what you deserve.
9 times out of 10 the ball that hit the post v Norwich goes in.
9 times out of 10 we don't get that penalty that Sinclair won and maybe 19/20 the ref doesn't compound the error by sending the bloke off!
Dozens of 'lucky' and 'unlucky' incidents throughout the whole season. | | | |
| Whingeing on 15:40 - Apr 23 with 1122 views | qprd |
| Whingeing on 13:04 - Apr 23 by dutch |
Not having that either. The fact that they had so much possession and pressure first half, yet got nothing just wore them down, allowing us to start coming out second half. That first half, backs against the wall, soak it up, keep em out, was the key to victory. |
Thats a tidy piece of revisionism, but thats not really what happened (nor is it how football works- when man city or barca have 80% possession, they're not the ones who tire in the second half- its the team whose been chasing shadows all game that flags. the notion that they were worn out is just not true)
The game basically was split into 4 parts: 1 went heavily to burnley, 1 went slightly to burnley, 1 was even and the last went to us
Part 1: first 20-25 minutes- absolute barrage, where we could've been down 5-0 (3 goal line clearances from dickie, crossbar struck, the one where the guy gets the wrong side of adomah and missed near post and the one where the left winger shot far post and missed the target). corner after corner conceded
Part 2: 25-58 mins (until sam field goal)- burnley dominates possession but the barrage on goal subsided. field basically scores a goal totally against hte run of play on a long throw in that bounced to him and he took his chance well- basically was our first chance of the match
Part 3: 58-75 (until burnley goal): fairly even: qpr basically started all of its time wasting tactics, which frustrated burnley and slowed down the game. qpr began to show a threat thanks to armstrongs channel running, which allowed qpr to gain possession when we lumped it up top. chairs dribbling and ball retention allowed qpr to get up the pitch
Part 4: 75-end: qpr probably the better of the two teams, with chair single handedly creating chances and armstrong continuing to trouble the back line.
scored the goal, and once that happened, we did all of the sh*thousery necessary to end the game
there's no notion of them getting worn out in the first half- they were all over us. they just happened to get unlucky and msis so many big chances. i mean, how many times does your centerback make a goalline clearance in a season? maybe 3 or 4 times? dickie made 3 goalline clearances in the first 25 minutes. there is no planning for that- thats just called getting the rub of the green
i dont blame ainsworth for trying to lap up the praise and claim this was some tactical masterplan- but this is how we play all our games under him...
i will give him credit for the armstrong and laird subs, but it begs the question- why were drewe and adomah playing in the first place? | | | |
| Whingeing on 15:48 - Apr 23 with 1092 views | PhilmyRs |
I’m not sure yesterday should change anything - there are people that like Ainsworth and think he’s doing an impossible job as well as he can, people that think the style of football and results have not been good enough, and those that are in the in-between camp. I still think Ainsworth is the wrong fit for us, I think he’s done a poor job and I wouldn’t have given him the job because of the type of manager he is and the type of club we’ve tried to become. Yesterday hasn’t changed that. I still love his passion and I’m even a fan of the after game interviews. He comes across very well. I don’t watch games hoping we lose so I have some supporting material to dig out Ainsworth with - I watch games for us to get that 3 points and that trumps everything.
I think as a club we’ve had some maverick players, real skilful game changers - Wegs, Adel, Eze and before my time Stan, Stainrod. Developing or signing these type of players in a system that our manager wants to install where he openly states “possession can do one” and where we have games where our centre midfielder didn’t complete a pass in 60 odd minutes is just not going to happen. If you were an agent of a ball playing midfielder that saw himself as a number 10 or creative, attacking midfielder, would you suggest Rangers as a good fit for them under Ainsworth? Where the emphasis is on what you do out of possession rather than what you do with it? I think that’s a shame and I think playing such a way will only last with results and the moment in changes patience wears thin. | | | |
| Whingeing on 15:53 - Apr 23 with 1072 views | E15Hoop |
| Whingeing on 15:40 - Apr 23 by qprd |
Thats a tidy piece of revisionism, but thats not really what happened (nor is it how football works- when man city or barca have 80% possession, they're not the ones who tire in the second half- its the team whose been chasing shadows all game that flags. the notion that they were worn out is just not true)
The game basically was split into 4 parts: 1 went heavily to burnley, 1 went slightly to burnley, 1 was even and the last went to us
Part 1: first 20-25 minutes- absolute barrage, where we could've been down 5-0 (3 goal line clearances from dickie, crossbar struck, the one where the guy gets the wrong side of adomah and missed near post and the one where the left winger shot far post and missed the target). corner after corner conceded
Part 2: 25-58 mins (until sam field goal)- burnley dominates possession but the barrage on goal subsided. field basically scores a goal totally against hte run of play on a long throw in that bounced to him and he took his chance well- basically was our first chance of the match
Part 3: 58-75 (until burnley goal): fairly even: qpr basically started all of its time wasting tactics, which frustrated burnley and slowed down the game. qpr began to show a threat thanks to armstrongs channel running, which allowed qpr to gain possession when we lumped it up top. chairs dribbling and ball retention allowed qpr to get up the pitch
Part 4: 75-end: qpr probably the better of the two teams, with chair single handedly creating chances and armstrong continuing to trouble the back line.
scored the goal, and once that happened, we did all of the sh*thousery necessary to end the game
there's no notion of them getting worn out in the first half- they were all over us. they just happened to get unlucky and msis so many big chances. i mean, how many times does your centerback make a goalline clearance in a season? maybe 3 or 4 times? dickie made 3 goalline clearances in the first 25 minutes. there is no planning for that- thats just called getting the rub of the green
i dont blame ainsworth for trying to lap up the praise and claim this was some tactical masterplan- but this is how we play all our games under him...
i will give him credit for the armstrong and laird subs, but it begs the question- why were drewe and adomah playing in the first place? |
Armstrong we know was coming back from injury and has a tendency to burn himself out, as we've seen previously.
As for Laird, take your pick depending on what you believe:
1. Various injuries/instances of cramping leading to the sense that he hasn't been 100% fit for the last couple of weeks or so,
2, GA has spotted that he might not be 100% committed to the cause, so dropped him from the squad the other day to see how he would react.
3. Drewe is more naturally defensively inclined, so would be the more natural fit to withstanding that inevitable first half onslaught, whereas Laird obviously gives you more offensive options, assuming you're still in the game at that point (or need to get back in it quickly). | | | |
| Whingeing on 16:04 - Apr 23 with 1038 views | E15Hoop |
| Whingeing on 15:48 - Apr 23 by PhilmyRs |
I’m not sure yesterday should change anything - there are people that like Ainsworth and think he’s doing an impossible job as well as he can, people that think the style of football and results have not been good enough, and those that are in the in-between camp. I still think Ainsworth is the wrong fit for us, I think he’s done a poor job and I wouldn’t have given him the job because of the type of manager he is and the type of club we’ve tried to become. Yesterday hasn’t changed that. I still love his passion and I’m even a fan of the after game interviews. He comes across very well. I don’t watch games hoping we lose so I have some supporting material to dig out Ainsworth with - I watch games for us to get that 3 points and that trumps everything.
I think as a club we’ve had some maverick players, real skilful game changers - Wegs, Adel, Eze and before my time Stan, Stainrod. Developing or signing these type of players in a system that our manager wants to install where he openly states “possession can do one” and where we have games where our centre midfielder didn’t complete a pass in 60 odd minutes is just not going to happen. If you were an agent of a ball playing midfielder that saw himself as a number 10 or creative, attacking midfielder, would you suggest Rangers as a good fit for them under Ainsworth? Where the emphasis is on what you do out of possession rather than what you do with it? I think that’s a shame and I think playing such a way will only last with results and the moment in changes patience wears thin. |
Again, Phil, as I've said previously,as have others, I wouldn't assume that the plan as it is now will necessarily be the plan going forwards.
We know we've needed points quickly, and that's finally started to happen.
Eze himself credits GA for helping him develop in his year on loan at Wycombe, and GA is clearly a big fan of Taylor Richards, and we will obviously see more of him next season than we have this.
Our two big weaknesses this season have been being far too slow to react when we lose the ball, and being far too slow when we do have possession. GA has come up with a plan to deal with both of those immediate issues, even if the solution has not been to everyone's taste.
Is that the end game? I doubt that is, otherwise why would you bother leaving Wycombe? I think its more the case of trying to lay a solid foundation to build on which we all know has been so sadly missing this season. | | | |
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| Whingeing on 16:28 - Apr 23 with 987 views | PhilmyRs |
| Whingeing on 16:04 - Apr 23 by E15Hoop |
Again, Phil, as I've said previously,as have others, I wouldn't assume that the plan as it is now will necessarily be the plan going forwards.
We know we've needed points quickly, and that's finally started to happen.
Eze himself credits GA for helping him develop in his year on loan at Wycombe, and GA is clearly a big fan of Taylor Richards, and we will obviously see more of him next season than we have this.
Our two big weaknesses this season have been being far too slow to react when we lose the ball, and being far too slow when we do have possession. GA has come up with a plan to deal with both of those immediate issues, even if the solution has not been to everyone's taste.
Is that the end game? I doubt that is, otherwise why would you bother leaving Wycombe? I think its more the case of trying to lay a solid foundation to build on which we all know has been so sadly missing this season. |
Time will tell but he openly talks about not having an interest in possession based football, it’s all about “moments” and what you do in them. That’s a fact. The famous Wycombe playoff final stat and their possession figures is again a fact. Talented ball playing midfielders will be known in the football league, again as an agent would a move for your client to a Warburton QPR or a Ainsworth QPR make more sense? The club is going to be a much harder sell for these type of players and I think we’ll suffer longer term. I do agree that what we saw yesterday is not where an Ainsworth team will end up in terms of style but I don’t think it’s going to be a dramatic change from that. Sh*t housing from minute one, having under 30% possession and having pass completion rates below 50% across the team will be regular occurrences in my opinion. [Post edited 23 Apr 2023 16:30]
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| Whingeing on 17:13 - Apr 23 with 909 views | E15Hoop |
| Whingeing on 16:28 - Apr 23 by PhilmyRs |
Time will tell but he openly talks about not having an interest in possession based football, it’s all about “moments” and what you do in them. That’s a fact. The famous Wycombe playoff final stat and their possession figures is again a fact. Talented ball playing midfielders will be known in the football league, again as an agent would a move for your client to a Warburton QPR or a Ainsworth QPR make more sense? The club is going to be a much harder sell for these type of players and I think we’ll suffer longer term. I do agree that what we saw yesterday is not where an Ainsworth team will end up in terms of style but I don’t think it’s going to be a dramatic change from that. Sh*t housing from minute one, having under 30% possession and having pass completion rates below 50% across the team will be regular occurrences in my opinion. [Post edited 23 Apr 2023 16:30]
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I definitely agree that winning matches will take priority over "winning in the right way", but Martin Rowlands still stood out in Ollie's team with Ainsworth in. Does the one necessarily have to exclude the other? Will he change things game by game depending on how the season's progressing and the relative fitness of players?
One thing I am certain of is that it won't play out exactly according to many people's chosen sterotype of GA. | | | |
| Whingeing on 17:38 - Apr 23 with 837 views | Antti_Heinola |
| Whingeing on 15:38 - Apr 23 by PinnerPaul |
As I keep banging on about though over 46 games you get what you deserve.
9 times out of 10 the ball that hit the post v Norwich goes in.
9 times out of 10 we don't get that penalty that Sinclair won and maybe 19/20 the ref doesn't compound the error by sending the bloke off!
Dozens of 'lucky' and 'unlucky' incidents throughout the whole season. |
yep, you can certainly say we got what we deserved this season - next to nothing and possible relegation with 2 games left! | |
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| Whingeing on 17:58 - Apr 23 with 788 views | stevenagehoop |
| Whingeing on 17:38 - Apr 23 by Antti_Heinola |
yep, you can certainly say we got what we deserved this season - next to nothing and possible relegation with 2 games left! |
Think that is a very remote possibility now thankfully. When assessing this season we should not forget that for a reasonable percentage we were riding high until all went horribly wrong. At that time whilst perhaps punching above our weight we were not relegation material either.
Over my time we have had many games where we have dominated matches and lost yesterday fortunately we rode our luck and gained three immense points. In our position that is all we needed and to be fair it matters not how we achieved it when we stay up the record books will show that we won and in years to come no one will care how. |  |
| I never lie but I don't always tell the truth |
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| Whingeing on 18:57 - Apr 23 with 674 views | RangersDave |
| Whingeing on 15:02 - Apr 23 by BrianMcCarthy |
Sorry, E15, I don't understand that logic.
Our first-half plan was to intentionally sit back and isolate the front two?
If so, it led to three clearances, one hit crossbar and one missed howler, seventeen shots, twelve inside the box, ten corners. It was a miracle that the game wasn't over by half-time. The tactics Ainsworth put in place at half-time could have been put in place before the game. Fair play to him for adjusting, though. |
Maybe Wild Thing was playing 'Rope a dope' with Burnley? |  |
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