| Travelman traveling on 14:33 - Feb 1 with 1487 views | Northolt_Rs |
| Travelman traveling on 14:05 - Feb 1 by A40Bosh |
Talking to a mate the 4 year contract thing might be a way around FFP/P&S. Maybe something to do with spreading the costs over a longer period. Don’t know how that works but I struggle to accept that we can play hardball with much better players and not renew contracts and let them walk away after offering lower wages and Travelman having a super agent that negotiated a good deal and got him 4 years. His basic must be awful otherwise there is no sense to it. |
He was already our player when Les gave him a new 4 year contract….there was no purchase fee to spread over the 4 years. We’ve paid this guy a wage for 7 years (since September 2014) for zero return. SEVEN FKN YEARS…. and we wonder why the club is broke. [Post edited 1 Feb 2023 14:33]
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| Scooters, Tunes, Trainers and QPR. |
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| Travelman traveling on 14:54 - Feb 1 with 1357 views | Wegerles_Stairs |
| Travelman traveling on 14:05 - Feb 1 by A40Bosh |
Talking to a mate the 4 year contract thing might be a way around FFP/P&S. Maybe something to do with spreading the costs over a longer period. Don’t know how that works but I struggle to accept that we can play hardball with much better players and not renew contracts and let them walk away after offering lower wages and Travelman having a super agent that negotiated a good deal and got him 4 years. His basic must be awful otherwise there is no sense to it. |
I'm sure he wrote to Jim'll Fix It asking to be a professional footballer and someone forgot it's only meant to be for an afternoon of filming. |  | | |
| Travelman traveling on 15:23 - Feb 1 with 1358 views | A40Bosh |
| Travelman traveling on 14:33 - Feb 1 by Northolt_Rs |
He was already our player when Les gave him a new 4 year contract….there was no purchase fee to spread over the 4 years. We’ve paid this guy a wage for 7 years (since September 2014) for zero return. SEVEN FKN YEARS…. and we wonder why the club is broke. [Post edited 1 Feb 2023 14:33]
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But I am talking about ongoing costs not transfer fees. Ongoing costs such as wages still get factored in.
There has to be more to this than Les and Lee are crap at their jobs. I don’t think Hoos will ever get any recognition he probably deserves for keeping us afloat since he began his tenure. I can imagine the language that would have come out of his mouth if someone came to him with a 4 year contract to be signed off if there was no sense to it from a business perspective |  |
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| Travelman traveling on 15:36 - Feb 1 with 1331 views | Dixie_CT |
A conservative estimate for Niko’s contract would be around £1.5m in wages, appreances fees, tax and Avios points.
Since his contact was awarded, his playing time equates to about 20 full games which breaks down to £75k a match.
If you think we couldn’t have got better value elsewhere, then I’m unsure what to say to you.
I don’t think anyone on this forum has ill wishes towards Niko, it’s just another example where a club that is trying to be financially effective has made a bad decision |  | | |
| Travelman traveling on 16:13 - Feb 1 with 1277 views | QPunkR |
| Travelman traveling on 15:36 - Feb 1 by Dixie_CT |
A conservative estimate for Niko’s contract would be around £1.5m in wages, appreances fees, tax and Avios points.
Since his contact was awarded, his playing time equates to about 20 full games which breaks down to £75k a match.
If you think we couldn’t have got better value elsewhere, then I’m unsure what to say to you.
I don’t think anyone on this forum has ill wishes towards Niko, it’s just another example where a club that is trying to be financially effective has made a bad decision |
Well said - he’s certainly not in the Boswanka league in the slightest. I think we’re all just aghast at how he’s made a living out of football.
In terms of giving him the long contact, I can see why the Club did it, like with Kakay, as they were on comparatively small wages and we were hoping (against hope!) that he’d blossom into a League 1 player someone else would want to pay us some cash money for down the line |  |
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| Travelman traveling on 16:43 - Feb 1 with 1250 views | Wilkinswatercarrier |
Is there really not a left back in the U21s who is better than him? If not then the U21s must be really really sh!t. | |
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| Travelman traveling on 17:12 - Feb 1 with 1195 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
He’s no Bobby Carlos, but I definitely feel like his footballing limitations are being over exaggerated to validate attacks on Les, the Board, or whoever else’s turn it is today. |  | | |
| Travelman traveling on 17:46 - Feb 1 with 1141 views | A40Bosh |
| Travelman traveling on 17:12 - Feb 1 by BazzaInTheLoft |
He’s no Bobby Carlos, but I definitely feel like his footballing limitations are being over exaggerated to validate attacks on Les, the Board, or whoever else’s turn it is today. |
Exactly- hindsight is a wonderful thing. I am not arguing that his contract has been good value but there has to be legit reasons why he was given the contract he was given. Was it bad business possibly. Is he the worst left back in the adult squads - well that only the coaches know.
Not against questioning decisions but there are a few who come across as Lord Sugar on here who think they know how to run the business properly and how to renew contracts. | |
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| Travelman traveling on 17:59 - Feb 1 with 1119 views | OutintheOrne |
| Travelman traveling on 16:43 - Feb 1 by Wilkinswatercarrier |
Is there really not a left back in the U21s who is better than him? If not then the U21s must be really really sh!t. |
Sorry, meant to update. | | | |
| Travelman traveling on 18:01 - Feb 1 with 1109 views | Harbour |
Well he may have been limited but unlike some players he has gone on loan all over the world and appears never refused to go out on loan unlike players we have a few years ago who allegedly refused to go on loan and sat on the sidelines taking their money for doing very little. Ultimately if there is fault it’s not the player it’s whoever agreed to give him the contract. | | | |
| Travelman traveling on 18:39 - Feb 1 with 1085 views | DieByYourSide |
| Travelman traveling on 17:12 - Feb 1 by BazzaInTheLoft |
He’s no Bobby Carlos, but I definitely feel like his footballing limitations are being over exaggerated to validate attacks on Les, the Board, or whoever else’s turn it is today. |
Lifestyle footballer | |
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| Travelman traveling on 18:48 - Feb 1 with 1057 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| Travelman traveling on 18:39 - Feb 1 by DieByYourSide |
Lifestyle footballer |
Does that include Kilmarnock and Dagenham & Redbridge 😆| | | |
| Travelman traveling on 18:56 - Feb 1 with 1044 views | DieByYourSide |
| Travelman traveling on 18:48 - Feb 1 by BazzaInTheLoft |
Does that include Kilmarnock and Dagenham & Redbridge 😆|
About to turn 26 and played 83 games according to Wikipedia. Doesn't exactly scream hungry, does it? | |
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| Travelman traveling on 19:05 - Feb 1 with 1025 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| Travelman traveling on 18:56 - Feb 1 by DieByYourSide |
About to turn 26 and played 83 games according to Wikipedia. Doesn't exactly scream hungry, does it? |
Well, Chris Willock is almost the same age and has only played 13 games more (Benfica B are reserves).
I’m not going to hate the lad, sorry. | | | |
| Travelman traveling on 19:27 - Feb 1 with 1013 views | Dixie_CT |
| Travelman traveling on 19:05 - Feb 1 by BazzaInTheLoft |
Well, Chris Willock is almost the same age and has only played 13 games more (Benfica B are reserves).
I’m not going to hate the lad, sorry. |
I’m not sure how questioning Niko’s ability, mentality, and the contract given to him (not his fault), translates as hatred.
From your position on Niko and other points, I presume you don’t think the Board, Lee, Les or the Academy staff, are responsible for the position we find ourselves in. If that is the case, who should we hold accountable? | | | |
| Travelman traveling on 19:46 - Feb 1 with 985 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| Travelman traveling on 19:27 - Feb 1 by Dixie_CT |
I’m not sure how questioning Niko’s ability, mentality, and the contract given to him (not his fault), translates as hatred.
From your position on Niko and other points, I presume you don’t think the Board, Lee, Les or the Academy staff, are responsible for the position we find ourselves in. If that is the case, who should we hold accountable? |
He’s been called a pisstaker, it’s been said it’s incredulous he’s played a professional game. That kind of over the top dialogue seems malicious to me. Criticism is fair enough but that isn’t what’s happening.
The position we find ourselves in is four points from playoffs in an inconsistent league, in an inconsistent season. We’re in bad form. For that I blame the players. All of them.
Overall it’s a pretty typical QPR season. Certainly in my lifetime anyway.
Les and board need to account for the impending FFP disaster, if reports are true. That’s inexcusable. Does that mean I want fck them all off without a better replacement ready? Absolutely not.
Overall I blame long term lack of investment in facilities and a fly by night culture that spans many regimes over four decades, probably since Gregory was owner.
Overall I accept that we are a small to medium football club for now, and I see progress in lots of places except in recent results. We have a winnable next three fixtures and if we win them this whole discussion of blame will disappear like a fart in a hurricane until the next blip in form.
No one is entitled to success, and the standing of football clubs is a flexible thing dependent on an immeasurable amount of factors and sliding doors moments. That’s not just football that’s life. No one needs to be blamed. [Post edited 1 Feb 2023 19:51]
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| Travelman traveling on 20:39 - Feb 1 with 934 views | Dixie_CT |
| Travelman traveling on 19:46 - Feb 1 by BazzaInTheLoft |
He’s been called a pisstaker, it’s been said it’s incredulous he’s played a professional game. That kind of over the top dialogue seems malicious to me. Criticism is fair enough but that isn’t what’s happening.
The position we find ourselves in is four points from playoffs in an inconsistent league, in an inconsistent season. We’re in bad form. For that I blame the players. All of them.
Overall it’s a pretty typical QPR season. Certainly in my lifetime anyway.
Les and board need to account for the impending FFP disaster, if reports are true. That’s inexcusable. Does that mean I want fck them all off without a better replacement ready? Absolutely not.
Overall I blame long term lack of investment in facilities and a fly by night culture that spans many regimes over four decades, probably since Gregory was owner.
Overall I accept that we are a small to medium football club for now, and I see progress in lots of places except in recent results. We have a winnable next three fixtures and if we win them this whole discussion of blame will disappear like a fart in a hurricane until the next blip in form.
No one is entitled to success, and the standing of football clubs is a flexible thing dependent on an immeasurable amount of factors and sliding doors moments. That’s not just football that’s life. No one needs to be blamed. [Post edited 1 Feb 2023 19:51]
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Cheers for taking the time to reply in such detail Bazza.
Hatred for and malicious is strong language which I just don’t get from someone call him a pisstaker, which to me translates as a bit more of a direct ‘phoning it in’ It’s a form of criticism and I don’t think anyone is intending to cause Niko harm or has an intense dislike of him as a person.
The position we find ourselves in is a squad of players who seem to have no desire to work hard and lack any pride in playing for the club. These are elementary things for any team to succeed and for fans to buy into. We are in a false league place when you look at our recent performances and results.
Since I’ve been watching QPR for about 32 seasons and in that time we’ve been relegated four times, promoted three times, and in the play offs twice. So the rest of the time we’ve been floating somewhere in between, so yeah, mid table is atypical season for us but there are mid table seasons watching Bright and Eze, and there are mid table seasons watching Tyler Roberts and Tim Irobugnam. Basically some are more enjoyable than others.
Blaming the players? 100% but who put them there in the first place? Belk, Les, the last 3/4 managers, Hoos, the Board. I know we live in an age where management (and politicians) shirk any responsibility for failings. This is what feels like is happening at the club and people are either got rid of or stay silent. When was the last time we heard from the Board, Hoos, Les, Ramsey? The BS fans forums and selected questions to reply to are an insult as they aren’t places for real dialogue. Briatore treated us with disdain and as idiots, well it may not be in the same style, but it’s starting to feel similar.
P&s/FFP is now raring it’s big ugly head and the recent window has highlighted that we are in a really precarious position. Yes COVID, big hit, can’t get away from that but gambling with the Eze money was not a smart move and that gamble has failed. Clive has highlighted the amount of money we spent post-Eze and we haven’t got much to show for it. Again, quite typical of QPR, ironically, the same happened when we sold Les and ended up with a written off Mark Hateley, a knackered Ned Zelic and a toe treading Simon Osborn. Hello relegation!
The facilities thing is interesting. Warren Farm and Old Oak projects which only wasted time, money and burned relationships. Again, who made the decision to pursue these projects? Heston, great, training ground secured but it was quite lucky that Imperial were looking to sell and not really part of a great strategy, just by chance. Linford Christie? The club messed it up, wrong approach, backs up and relationships soured beyond repair. You’re more likely to get Hoos and Cowan into the Octagon than the meeting room.
Yeah we are probably in our place but it’s frustrating as hell when the likes of Brighton and Bournemouth (broke FFP, but did it in the right way and stayed up!) go flying past you and add Fulham and Brentford (Brentford!!!) to the equation, and you can understand why people are starting to get a little bit irked by a falling down stadium, propaganda that this manager and this group of players are going be the ones and the Academy is staffed by cronyism and hasn’t produced anything anywhere near the investment in staff wages and operations.
No one needs to be blamed? See earlier point, some fu cker should be responsible for it, indeed it’s some peoples paid job to take responsibility. Sadly, no one at the club has the balls or can be bothered to do anything about it. | | | |
| Travelman traveling on 20:57 - Feb 1 with 909 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| Travelman traveling on 20:39 - Feb 1 by Dixie_CT |
Cheers for taking the time to reply in such detail Bazza.
Hatred for and malicious is strong language which I just don’t get from someone call him a pisstaker, which to me translates as a bit more of a direct ‘phoning it in’ It’s a form of criticism and I don’t think anyone is intending to cause Niko harm or has an intense dislike of him as a person.
The position we find ourselves in is a squad of players who seem to have no desire to work hard and lack any pride in playing for the club. These are elementary things for any team to succeed and for fans to buy into. We are in a false league place when you look at our recent performances and results.
Since I’ve been watching QPR for about 32 seasons and in that time we’ve been relegated four times, promoted three times, and in the play offs twice. So the rest of the time we’ve been floating somewhere in between, so yeah, mid table is atypical season for us but there are mid table seasons watching Bright and Eze, and there are mid table seasons watching Tyler Roberts and Tim Irobugnam. Basically some are more enjoyable than others.
Blaming the players? 100% but who put them there in the first place? Belk, Les, the last 3/4 managers, Hoos, the Board. I know we live in an age where management (and politicians) shirk any responsibility for failings. This is what feels like is happening at the club and people are either got rid of or stay silent. When was the last time we heard from the Board, Hoos, Les, Ramsey? The BS fans forums and selected questions to reply to are an insult as they aren’t places for real dialogue. Briatore treated us with disdain and as idiots, well it may not be in the same style, but it’s starting to feel similar.
P&s/FFP is now raring it’s big ugly head and the recent window has highlighted that we are in a really precarious position. Yes COVID, big hit, can’t get away from that but gambling with the Eze money was not a smart move and that gamble has failed. Clive has highlighted the amount of money we spent post-Eze and we haven’t got much to show for it. Again, quite typical of QPR, ironically, the same happened when we sold Les and ended up with a written off Mark Hateley, a knackered Ned Zelic and a toe treading Simon Osborn. Hello relegation!
The facilities thing is interesting. Warren Farm and Old Oak projects which only wasted time, money and burned relationships. Again, who made the decision to pursue these projects? Heston, great, training ground secured but it was quite lucky that Imperial were looking to sell and not really part of a great strategy, just by chance. Linford Christie? The club messed it up, wrong approach, backs up and relationships soured beyond repair. You’re more likely to get Hoos and Cowan into the Octagon than the meeting room.
Yeah we are probably in our place but it’s frustrating as hell when the likes of Brighton and Bournemouth (broke FFP, but did it in the right way and stayed up!) go flying past you and add Fulham and Brentford (Brentford!!!) to the equation, and you can understand why people are starting to get a little bit irked by a falling down stadium, propaganda that this manager and this group of players are going be the ones and the Academy is staffed by cronyism and hasn’t produced anything anywhere near the investment in staff wages and operations.
No one needs to be blamed? See earlier point, some fu cker should be responsible for it, indeed it’s some peoples paid job to take responsibility. Sadly, no one at the club has the balls or can be bothered to do anything about it. |
I'm not going to write an essay in response but I think the main problem is people expectations. Mine is clearly lower than yours and a lot of people's. That's not to be confused with a lack of ambition, I just think we'll take longer to get there.
What I will say though, is that this same group of players had us top of the league and the second best team in the country by form 18 months ago. No one had heard of Belk then and they certainly weren't giving Les etc any credit.
Makes me wonder if this whole surge of online anger, which feels fairly recent, isn't just QPR fans winding themselves up. Why do that to ourselves, when we can just go to the football, enjoy the craic with pals and family. | | | |
| Travelman traveling on 21:08 - Feb 1 with 887 views | Hooping_Mad |
I think with Les it's more the cronyism that winds people up. Given his history and status had he brought in a wider range of people in I think we would wait till the end of time for him to come good in the role.
We do have an old boys network of overpaid types looking over every managers shoulder and facts are Warbs got fed up with it, eel couldn't wait to leave and Scteve had a direct line to the chairman as he ignored pursuing Les's remit from day 1
The question should be what are they getting right? | |
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| Travelman traveling on 21:12 - Feb 1 with 884 views | Dixie_CT |
| Travelman traveling on 20:57 - Feb 1 by BazzaInTheLoft |
I'm not going to write an essay in response but I think the main problem is people expectations. Mine is clearly lower than yours and a lot of people's. That's not to be confused with a lack of ambition, I just think we'll take longer to get there.
What I will say though, is that this same group of players had us top of the league and the second best team in the country by form 18 months ago. No one had heard of Belk then and they certainly weren't giving Les etc any credit.
Makes me wonder if this whole surge of online anger, which feels fairly recent, isn't just QPR fans winding themselves up. Why do that to ourselves, when we can just go to the football, enjoy the craic with pals and family. |
Use AI to reply, like garlic bread; it's the future.
My frustration is from a place of expecting some basic professional standards from the club, on and off the pitch.
I’m wound up because QPR has played such a big part of my life. It’s my obsession, it’s my faith, it’s my tribe, it’s a huge part of my identity. Bonkers and unhealthy? Probably. Something that is going to change in the future? Maybe. Will I ever stop caring? Probably not. | | | |
| Travelman traveling on 21:43 - Feb 1 with 842 views | BrianMcCarthy |
Jesis Christ. This is way over the top. |  |
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| Travelman traveling on 21:51 - Feb 1 with 815 views | Lblock |
| Travelman traveling on 21:08 - Feb 1 by Hooping_Mad |
I think with Les it's more the cronyism that winds people up. Given his history and status had he brought in a wider range of people in I think we would wait till the end of time for him to come good in the role.
We do have an old boys network of overpaid types looking over every managers shoulder and facts are Warbs got fed up with it, eel couldn't wait to leave and Scteve had a direct line to the chairman as he ignored pursuing Les's remit from day 1
The question should be what are they getting right? |
He’s pushing as many managers out as he can so that Tactics Timmy Sherwood is the only show left in town!!!!!! |  |
| Cherish and enjoy life.... this ain't no dress rehearsal |
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| Travelman traveling on 22:01 - Feb 1 with 755 views | Hooping_Mad |
| Travelman traveling on 21:43 - Feb 1 by BrianMcCarthy |
Jesis Christ. This is way over the top. |
Had a tear in my eye, you've ruined it. | |
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| Travelman traveling on 22:02 - Feb 1 with 740 views | Wegerles_Stairs |
| Travelman traveling on 21:08 - Feb 1 by Hooping_Mad |
I think with Les it's more the cronyism that winds people up. Given his history and status had he brought in a wider range of people in I think we would wait till the end of time for him to come good in the role.
We do have an old boys network of overpaid types looking over every managers shoulder and facts are Warbs got fed up with it, eel couldn't wait to leave and Scteve had a direct line to the chairman as he ignored pursuing Les's remit from day 1
The question should be what are they getting right? |
Yes, the way Warburton was thrown under the bus last season is what resonates with me. All very well doing that but when we can all see that the likes of Niko, Kakay and Shodipo aren't good enough despite being persisted with for season after season to justify the cronyism, then his position becomes far from tenable. Unfortunately, we have extremely naive owners who are all too easy to influence. Want to get rid of Harry? Get in their ear and tell them how brilliant your mate is. Pretty much been cronyism from day one. | | | |
| Travelman traveling on 22:06 - Feb 1 with 714 views | A40Bosh |
| Travelman traveling on 21:08 - Feb 1 by Hooping_Mad |
I think with Les it's more the cronyism that winds people up. Given his history and status had he brought in a wider range of people in I think we would wait till the end of time for him to come good in the role.
We do have an old boys network of overpaid types looking over every managers shoulder and facts are Warbs got fed up with it, eel couldn't wait to leave and Scteve had a direct line to the chairman as he ignored pursuing Les's remit from day 1
The question should be what are they getting right? |
Perceived cronyism I would argue.
Maybe because QPR is our club we take more of an interest in who we have in various management positions across the various departments within our club - but is it really any worse than other DOFs or management teams? | |
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