| Ashes thread 17:11 - Jul 15 with 95742 views | johnhoop |
Now that the World Cup’s done and dusted we can turn our attention to the next major event.
For me the most interesting questions about team selection are;
1) Do we open with Jason Roy? For me it’s a no brainer. I know all the arguments against- he doesn’t even open for Surrey, he struggles against the moving ball etc- but I feel that he’s in such good form and the alternatives are so mediocre that it would be silly not to. If he does come off he could give us control of the game in the first couple of hours. Him and Rory Burns for me.
2) Now that Jofra Archer has to have a place in the side, who are the other two quick bowlers going to be. If fit I guess Anderson has to play and I would give the third spot to Woakes but this means no place for Stuart Broad and the 90 mph+ Mark Wood.
3) Which spinner to go with - Ali or Rashid? Ali’s batting form seems to have dipped but it’s still not an easy decision to make.
Any thoughts? |  | | |  |
| Ashes thread on 19:56 - Sep 8 with 1929 views | willis1980 |
| Ashes thread on 19:44 - Sep 8 by Snipper |
I just don’t get your hatred towards England. When I lived in Australia for a year, I became more passionate about being English, and where I hailed from.
It was the same for any English people we met who had emigrated.
If I’d have stayed in Australia (and I had the chance to) I’d have now been there 30 years. There would have been absolutely no chance of me ever supporting Australia over England, whatever the sport. |
Just like Pattinsons family then, who had to have their arm twisted to support their son and brother playing for Australia. | | | |
| Ashes thread on 20:30 - Sep 8 with 1880 views | pastieR |
| Ashes thread on 19:41 - Sep 8 by willis1980 |
I think Denly can actually open, he’ll grow into the role. I don’t quite understand what the gripe with Wokes is, i think he’s got a good work rate, is a team player and can bat.
I know there’s excuses and then there’s excuses but it’s relatively unsurprising that the majority of those that have underperformed have played a lot of cricket of late.
I think there have been some really positive glimpses throughout this series, whenever I thought England would fold like deckchairs they showed some real grit and determination.
Burns has outperformed a lot of players his senior on both sides.
Archer will be great as long as people just let him do his thing. Imagine him in tandem with Anderson and then broad too!
Denly will grow into his role
Bairstow will be back
Buttler will be better given some time too
Will we ever see moeen in an England shirt again?
Roy will have to go though, I just don’t think he’s a red ball player. Just like Morgan, Compton was better than Roy and got the elbow.
Leach is good but I not sure whether I don’t prefer Rashid tbh |
i assumed woakes hasn't been fully fit?, considering the amount he has bowled when picked | | | |
| Ashes thread on 20:44 - Sep 8 with 1867 views | willis1980 |
| Ashes thread on 20:30 - Sep 8 by pastieR |
i assumed woakes hasn't been fully fit?, considering the amount he has bowled when picked |
I dunno if some of the pundits are to be believed there seems to be some sort of upset between him and root, fitness was never mentioned as far as I remember | | | |
| Ashes thread on 20:49 - Sep 8 with 1851 views | isawqpratwcity |
| Ashes thread on 19:44 - Sep 8 by Snipper |
I just don’t get your hatred towards England. When I lived in Australia for a year, I became more passionate about being English, and where I hailed from.
It was the same for any English people we met who had emigrated.
If I’d have stayed in Australia (and I had the chance to) I’d have now been there 30 years. There would have been absolutely no chance of me ever supporting Australia over England, whatever the sport. |
I have to remind you that I don't hate England, but otherwise, on what you've said there, I do agree that we are very different people.
I look forward to our continued exchange of views in the future, or of my receiving further down-arrows from you, in the event that you can't think of anything to say. |  |
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| Ashes thread on 21:02 - Sep 8 with 1837 views | Rangersw12 |
| Ashes thread on 19:19 - Sep 8 by isawqpratwcity |
A Classless Nerk
I am not bitter towards England. It's you lot, you are just so much fun! 
Hammersmith General Hospital, Du Cane Road, W12 (go on, beat that!). Yes and yes, also Welsh and English.
I'm still not predicting an Aussie win in this series but what do I know? |
Ah so your just trolling then
What a wonderful and exciting life you must lead ! | | | |
| Ashes thread on 21:14 - Sep 8 with 1814 views | Hooparoo |
| Ashes thread on 21:02 - Sep 8 by Rangersw12 |
Ah so your just trolling then
What a wonderful and exciting life you must lead ! |
We should all remember that the only reason any of us are on this forum is because we all love a funny little football club in West London.
For me, the highlight of the day was Stokes walking when caught behind. Classy and a great example of good sportsmanship. |  |
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| Ashes thread on 21:17 - Sep 8 with 1808 views | Snipper |
| Ashes thread on 20:49 - Sep 8 by isawqpratwcity |
I have to remind you that I don't hate England, but otherwise, on what you've said there, I do agree that we are very different people.
I look forward to our continued exchange of views in the future, or of my receiving further down-arrows from you, in the event that you can't think of anything to say. |
I actually enjoy having banter with you. In all the years I’ve been on this board, I can probably count all the down arrows I’ve done on one hand.
I down arrowed your post because I can’t believe an English person would take great satisfaction in losing to their greatest enemy at cricket.
I just think it’s weird. |  | | |
| Ashes thread on 21:18 - Sep 8 with 1796 views | isawqpratwcity |
| Ashes thread on 21:02 - Sep 8 by Rangersw12 |
Ah so your just trolling then
What a wonderful and exciting life you must lead ! |
Indeed.
Why don't you tell everyone your justification for accusing me of having "backward and racist views" and see if it stands scrutiny? | |
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| Ashes thread on 21:39 - Sep 8 with 1756 views | isawqpratwcity |
| Ashes thread on 21:17 - Sep 8 by Snipper |
I actually enjoy having banter with you. In all the years I’ve been on this board, I can probably count all the down arrows I’ve done on one hand.
I down arrowed your post because I can’t believe an English person would take great satisfaction in losing to their greatest enemy at cricket.
I just think it’s weird. |
Ta. Me, too.
But as for "I can’t believe an English person would take great satisfaction in losing to their greatest enemy at cricket"? You don't hear the pomposity in that?
Also, the idea that, the longer you stayed in Oz, the more English you'd become? You do realise that it is that sort of sentiment that Aussies (and Kiwis) both expect and dislike from the English?
And that is just sad. | |
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| Ashes thread on 22:01 - Sep 8 with 1739 views | Snipper |
| Ashes thread on 21:39 - Sep 8 by isawqpratwcity |
Ta. Me, too.
But as for "I can’t believe an English person would take great satisfaction in losing to their greatest enemy at cricket"? You don't hear the pomposity in that?
Also, the idea that, the longer you stayed in Oz, the more English you'd become? You do realise that it is that sort of sentiment that Aussies (and Kiwis) both expect and dislike from the English?
And that is just sad. |
‘Also, the idea that, the longer you stayed in Oz, the more English you'd become? You do realise that it is that sort of sentiment that Aussies (and Kiwis) both expect and dislike from the English?’
That works both ways fella. The Aussies & Kiwis you get over here are the same. But the difference is, we don’t hate them or dislike them because of who they are. And I wouldn’t be so quick to put the Kiwis in the same boat as the Aussies when it comes to hating the English.
I also stayed in New Zealand for 2 and a half months. I can honestly say that the Kiwis were fantastic people who didn’t give out insults.
The Aussies on the other hand, loved dishing out insults. It was like they were testing you, to see how you’d react. With 99% of them, I laughed it off and we ended up having friendly banter, but the other 1% hated you no matter what.
I loved my time in Australia & New Zealand though. One thing we did impress them with was our drinking. Jesus, we put some away. I can’t drink for shìt nowadays. Lol [Post edited 8 Sep 2019 22:02]
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| Ashes thread on 22:31 - Sep 8 with 1703 views | ted_hendrix |
| Ashes thread on 22:01 - Sep 8 by Snipper |
‘Also, the idea that, the longer you stayed in Oz, the more English you'd become? You do realise that it is that sort of sentiment that Aussies (and Kiwis) both expect and dislike from the English?’
That works both ways fella. The Aussies & Kiwis you get over here are the same. But the difference is, we don’t hate them or dislike them because of who they are. And I wouldn’t be so quick to put the Kiwis in the same boat as the Aussies when it comes to hating the English.
I also stayed in New Zealand for 2 and a half months. I can honestly say that the Kiwis were fantastic people who didn’t give out insults.
The Aussies on the other hand, loved dishing out insults. It was like they were testing you, to see how you’d react. With 99% of them, I laughed it off and we ended up having friendly banter, but the other 1% hated you no matter what.
I loved my time in Australia & New Zealand though. One thing we did impress them with was our drinking. Jesus, we put some away. I can’t drink for shìt nowadays. Lol [Post edited 8 Sep 2019 22:02]
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" I can’t drink for shìt nowadays. Lol"
I can vouch for that.  |  |
| My Father had a profound influence on me, he was a lunatic. |
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| Ashes thread on 22:38 - Sep 8 with 1694 views | Snipper |
| Ashes thread on 22:31 - Sep 8 by ted_hendrix |
" I can’t drink for shìt nowadays. Lol"
I can vouch for that. |
They all can 🤣🤣🤣.
Are you getting down the Rangers this season Ted? | | | |
| Ashes thread on 22:45 - Sep 8 with 1681 views | isawqpratwcity |
| Ashes thread on 22:01 - Sep 8 by Snipper |
‘Also, the idea that, the longer you stayed in Oz, the more English you'd become? You do realise that it is that sort of sentiment that Aussies (and Kiwis) both expect and dislike from the English?’
That works both ways fella. The Aussies & Kiwis you get over here are the same. But the difference is, we don’t hate them or dislike them because of who they are. And I wouldn’t be so quick to put the Kiwis in the same boat as the Aussies when it comes to hating the English.
I also stayed in New Zealand for 2 and a half months. I can honestly say that the Kiwis were fantastic people who didn’t give out insults.
The Aussies on the other hand, loved dishing out insults. It was like they were testing you, to see how you’d react. With 99% of them, I laughed it off and we ended up having friendly banter, but the other 1% hated you no matter what.
I loved my time in Australia & New Zealand though. One thing we did impress them with was our drinking. Jesus, we put some away. I can’t drink for shìt nowadays. Lol [Post edited 8 Sep 2019 22:02]
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So you do actually get the irreverence that is the pearl of antipodean culture? How can you appreciate that and yet expect, indeed, hope to get 'more English'? (I do find it genuinely sad when people strongly resist any degree of assimilation.)
Alas, Pommy Bashing (metaphorical) isn't unknown in NZ. I can remember being introduced as a new immigrant and being immediately asked "So, what don't you like about the place?" I suppose they'd found that with Whingeing Poms, it saved time.
As for the cultural handicaps of Kiwis and Aussies, sure, no-one is fault-free. I still have a recognisable London accent, and am always happy to wear the 'Pommy Bastard' hat and distribute salient observations when required. [Post edited 8 Sep 2019 22:50]
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| Ashes thread on 22:56 - Sep 8 with 1671 views | ozexile |
I'm expecting lots of good natured abuse today and rightly so. I was on my high horse and still am after our World Cup win. Never had a problem being a POM in Oz.
The Aussies will accept anyone if you can give it out and take it back. | | | |
| Ashes thread on 00:03 - Sep 9 with 1647 views | Pommyhoop |
| Ashes thread on 22:01 - Sep 8 by Snipper |
‘Also, the idea that, the longer you stayed in Oz, the more English you'd become? You do realise that it is that sort of sentiment that Aussies (and Kiwis) both expect and dislike from the English?’
That works both ways fella. The Aussies & Kiwis you get over here are the same. But the difference is, we don’t hate them or dislike them because of who they are. And I wouldn’t be so quick to put the Kiwis in the same boat as the Aussies when it comes to hating the English.
I also stayed in New Zealand for 2 and a half months. I can honestly say that the Kiwis were fantastic people who didn’t give out insults.
The Aussies on the other hand, loved dishing out insults. It was like they were testing you, to see how you’d react. With 99% of them, I laughed it off and we ended up having friendly banter, but the other 1% hated you no matter what.
I loved my time in Australia & New Zealand though. One thing we did impress them with was our drinking. Jesus, we put some away. I can’t drink for shìt nowadays. Lol [Post edited 8 Sep 2019 22:02]
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The above is correct. My neighbour hails from the fluffy white cloud land and loves me but hates all things Australian. After many a session on the stubbies listening to his views I've come to the realization ( I'm half Irish BTW) that it is similar to the Irish and English relationship. Oh, did I mention his main gripe is the Ozzies love to dish it out but cannot take it back... |  |
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| Ashes thread on 00:05 - Sep 9 with 1644 views | ted_hendrix |
| Ashes thread on 22:38 - Sep 8 by Snipper |
They all can 🤣🤣🤣.
Are you getting down the Rangers this season Ted? |
Most definitely mate, however my time is full on busy at the moment as after me buying our house some 40 bloody years we sold it a couple of Months ago and we're moving to Wantage next Monday, never in my wildest dreams did I imagine what moving house could do to my stress levels, never again.
The murky world of estate agents and conveyancing solicitors, opened my eyes up that's for sure, anyway enough of this bolox, be lucky---give my regards to Johnjo if you can get a word in edge-ways  | |
| My Father had a profound influence on me, he was a lunatic. |
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| Ashes thread on 04:34 - Sep 9 with 1574 views | isawqpratwcity |
| Ashes thread on 00:03 - Sep 9 by Pommyhoop |
The above is correct. My neighbour hails from the fluffy white cloud land and loves me but hates all things Australian. After many a session on the stubbies listening to his views I've come to the realization ( I'm half Irish BTW) that it is similar to the Irish and English relationship. Oh, did I mention his main gripe is the Ozzies love to dish it out but cannot take it back... |
I have found the best way to break the ice in social situations is to announce that "Hi, I'm Jim, your worst nightmare: a Pom with a Kiwi passport."
That usually drops the match into the box of fireworks nicely. | |
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| Ashes thread on 04:56 - Sep 9 with 1569 views | SydneyRs |
| Ashes thread on 22:56 - Sep 8 by ozexile |
I'm expecting lots of good natured abuse today and rightly so. I was on my high horse and still am after our World Cup win. Never had a problem being a POM in Oz.
The Aussies will accept anyone if you can give it out and take it back. |
True, its the media rather than people in general. The media is still obsessed with this 1970s style pom bashing nonsense and need to grow up a bit but its easily ignored. The country has moved on, even since I've lived here, is no longer dominated by white, sport obsessed bogans and is a better place for it. Don't think the media has yet woken up to this. My wife is a born and bred Aussie and she hated that culture when growing up.
You do still regularly hear comments on TV and radio directed at the English that would have everyone screaming about racism if it was about any other nationality. Its predictable, unfunny and boring but they wouldn't dare say the same things about certain other groups. Not in public anyway.
The difference is playing England is everything to them, and not just in cricket, but we just don't have the same feelings in return. Yes they are a big rival in cricket but more because they are usually one of the strongest teams in a sport of few strong teams, as are India. Like most English people, I've never been a big cricket fan and was genuinely taken aback by how much they care about it down here.
The feeling after this is more "well its only cricket". I like England to win at cricket, or any sport, but its certainly far from a passion. Nobody gets relegated, there aren't any real consequences for losing as demonstrated by England going nearly 20 years without an Ashes win and getting another go every 2 years until they eventually won a series in 2005. Nothing like the devastating feeling of losing v Croatia and Germany in the world cup/Euro semi finals that's for sure.
As for supporting your adopted country over your home country, no. Just no. I wouldn't expect Aussies in the UK to do it and neither should any English person living here. | | | |
| Ashes thread on 05:57 - Sep 9 with 1554 views | 18StoneOfHoop |
To me this is just exactly like
That bizarre 1986 occurence
In some other sport or other.
The 4th Test never happened.
Forthwith let it be known:
To spare Aussie blushes
We declared after the perfect Ben 3rd. [Post edited 10 Sep 2019 5:16]
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| 'I'm 18 with a bullet.Got my finger on the trigger,I'm gonna pull it.."
Love,Peace and Fook Chelski!
More like 20StoneOfHoop now.
Let's face it I'm not getting any thinner.
Pass the cake and pies please. |
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| Ashes thread on 07:53 - Sep 9 with 1514 views | Pommyhoop |
| Ashes thread on 04:56 - Sep 9 by SydneyRs |
True, its the media rather than people in general. The media is still obsessed with this 1970s style pom bashing nonsense and need to grow up a bit but its easily ignored. The country has moved on, even since I've lived here, is no longer dominated by white, sport obsessed bogans and is a better place for it. Don't think the media has yet woken up to this. My wife is a born and bred Aussie and she hated that culture when growing up.
You do still regularly hear comments on TV and radio directed at the English that would have everyone screaming about racism if it was about any other nationality. Its predictable, unfunny and boring but they wouldn't dare say the same things about certain other groups. Not in public anyway.
The difference is playing England is everything to them, and not just in cricket, but we just don't have the same feelings in return. Yes they are a big rival in cricket but more because they are usually one of the strongest teams in a sport of few strong teams, as are India. Like most English people, I've never been a big cricket fan and was genuinely taken aback by how much they care about it down here.
The feeling after this is more "well its only cricket". I like England to win at cricket, or any sport, but its certainly far from a passion. Nobody gets relegated, there aren't any real consequences for losing as demonstrated by England going nearly 20 years without an Ashes win and getting another go every 2 years until they eventually won a series in 2005. Nothing like the devastating feeling of losing v Croatia and Germany in the world cup/Euro semi finals that's for sure.
As for supporting your adopted country over your home country, no. Just no. I wouldn't expect Aussies in the UK to do it and neither should any English person living here. |
Fair enuff summary
Good post mate.. | |
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| Ashes thread on 08:11 - Sep 9 with 1506 views | Miss_Terraces |
| Ashes thread on 05:57 - Sep 9 by 18StoneOfHoop |
To me this is just exactly like
That bizarre 1986 occurence
In some other sport or other.
The 4th Test never happened.
Forthwith let it be known:
To spare Aussie blushes
We declared after the perfect Ben 3rd. [Post edited 10 Sep 2019 5:16]
|
They still get to keep the ashes. I'm not counting any runs by cheats.
The Pakistani players were banned for between 5 and 10 years for spot fixing. I don't see how, what the Aussies did was any better.
They all woke up in the morning, knowing they were going to cheat. | |
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| Ashes thread on 13:04 - Sep 9 with 1387 views | johnhoop |
Just come in to find out they’ve named an unchanged squad for the Oval. I just find the sheer complacency and hubris of that to be quite staggering. It really has become the old boys club again with absolutely no consequences for repeated poor performance.
It really goes against the grain for me not to want England to win a match and I’ll probably feel different when it starts but right now I feel the best thing for the English test team in the long term would be if they got stuffed out of sight again at the Oval so Root may have to finally face up to the fact that he’s not a captain and whoever replaces him can shake it up a bit. | | | |
| Ashes thread on 13:29 - Sep 9 with 1368 views | CamberleyR |
| Ashes thread on 13:04 - Sep 9 by johnhoop |
Just come in to find out they’ve named an unchanged squad for the Oval. I just find the sheer complacency and hubris of that to be quite staggering. It really has become the old boys club again with absolutely no consequences for repeated poor performance.
It really goes against the grain for me not to want England to win a match and I’ll probably feel different when it starts but right now I feel the best thing for the English test team in the long term would be if they got stuffed out of sight again at the Oval so Root may have to finally face up to the fact that he’s not a captain and whoever replaces him can shake it up a bit. |
Staggering that Roy is keeping his place. Yes he battled for 60 odd balls and nearly two hours to get 30 but it was always only a matter of time before they got him out. Nobody wants to go back to the days of two test failures and you're out but enough is enough. He is just not good enough. Bairstow can also consider himself extremely fortunate.
At the tea break yesterday Nasser Hussain did some split screen comparisons of how Denly is playing their attack with Roy. It was chalk and cheese. Massive gaps between bat and pad when he has been out bowled or leg before, braced front leg meaning his balance is all over the place and hands way in front of him pushing hard at the ball.
I could go on but the point is that if these flaws in his technique are quickly being picked up on telly by the Sky commentators, why aren't the England coaching staff spotting this and if they are what is Graham Thorpe the batting coach doing about it? About time he started earning his money methinks.
Because of the absolutely idiotic scheduling of the county championship though, there has been nobody pressing their case with weight of runs to be picked because nobody's been playing. |  |
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| Ashes thread on 14:53 - Sep 9 with 1304 views | TheChef |
| Ashes thread on 13:29 - Sep 9 by CamberleyR |
Staggering that Roy is keeping his place. Yes he battled for 60 odd balls and nearly two hours to get 30 but it was always only a matter of time before they got him out. Nobody wants to go back to the days of two test failures and you're out but enough is enough. He is just not good enough. Bairstow can also consider himself extremely fortunate.
At the tea break yesterday Nasser Hussain did some split screen comparisons of how Denly is playing their attack with Roy. It was chalk and cheese. Massive gaps between bat and pad when he has been out bowled or leg before, braced front leg meaning his balance is all over the place and hands way in front of him pushing hard at the ball.
I could go on but the point is that if these flaws in his technique are quickly being picked up on telly by the Sky commentators, why aren't the England coaching staff spotting this and if they are what is Graham Thorpe the batting coach doing about it? About time he started earning his money methinks.
Because of the absolutely idiotic scheduling of the county championship though, there has been nobody pressing their case with weight of runs to be picked because nobody's been playing. |
Sky were also suggesting yesterday that Stokes could play as a batsman only and move to 4, with Roy dropping down to 5 (or him or Buttler missing out completely). So you'd need another seamer with Woakes probably coming back in, or Curran if you wanted to give him a go.
Will barely make any difference, and if they prepare the usual flat deck then we won't have any chance of winning. Offer a green top and gamble on our bowlers hitting their straps as a unit. |  |
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| Ashes thread on 15:09 - Sep 9 with 1301 views | CamberleyR |
| Ashes thread on 14:53 - Sep 9 by TheChef |
Sky were also suggesting yesterday that Stokes could play as a batsman only and move to 4, with Roy dropping down to 5 (or him or Buttler missing out completely). So you'd need another seamer with Woakes probably coming back in, or Curran if you wanted to give him a go.
Will barely make any difference, and if they prepare the usual flat deck then we won't have any chance of winning. Offer a green top and gamble on our bowlers hitting their straps as a unit. |
A green top is the way I'd go as well. Prepare another wicket like we have done throughout this series and you can lump on Smith getting another couple of hundreds and kiss goodbye getting a result to level the series. The Ashes are gone but it would be nice to keep the unbeaten home record going.
We need to play to our strengths and at the moment it is bowling rather than batting and a grassy pitch giving lots of movement seems to be the best chance of getting him out right now. It would be a low scoring game as you wouldn't fancy us getting much of a score against their seamers but as you say we need to gamble. | |
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