| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report 15:58 - Mar 4 with 6736 views | Northernr |
Ok, well I can sense from the debates on here today there's going to be some strong disagreement with some of this, but here it is for what it's worth anyway.
https://www.fansnetwork.co.uk/ |  | | |  |
| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 19:32 - Mar 4 with 2435 views | daveB |
| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 19:00 - Mar 4 by stevec |
Can’t agree, Wimbledon used brute force right across the pitch,that wasn’t what I saw last night. |
The 80's version did but the early 90's under Kinnear they were very quick to close down, got the ball forward quickly and had real quality in Earle, Leonardsen to create chances. They were always a nightmare to play against |  | | |
| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 20:47 - Mar 4 with 2325 views | ericgen34 |
| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 17:37 - Mar 4 by Antti_Heinola |
Agree with that excellent report. I wouldn't say Barnsley were *quite* as great as you say, and it's not 'sniffy' to say you don't enjoy prolonged periods of head tennis in middle fifth of the pitch, it's just personal preference, surely? Equally sniffy to say you don't like defenders 'fannying about with it' (re: passing the football) if that is the case.
I do agree they played nice stuff up top, mind. I found it an absorbing game - 1st half more than the 2nd, where they shut us off very well - but overall, it was long periods of ugly stuff mixed with great effective play and some lovely skill from Mowatt (top class free kick that, nigh on unsaveable).
It looked revolutionary, I'll give it that. A bit like South Korea in 2002 (I remember one journo calling that 'frenzy football') - but they did it without their defenders crashing the ball sky high 8/10 times they received it.
Be interesting to see how they continue this season and next. |
It certainly did seem revolutionary to me, in that I havent seen anything like that since being able to watch games regularly like we are able to nowadays
It almost felt like how it would have felt like watching the sex pistols the first time. What the feck was that?? I like that! |  | | |
| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 21:24 - Mar 4 with 2266 views | bosh67 |
Someone on a w*nk news site called for Warbs to go because of the last 2 games. Thought we should get Pearson in....
We went on a terrible run and everyone wanted Warbs out, all the players were rubbish. Then we got players on loan and won loads of games. We gave credit to Warbs and the team and looked to global domination. We wanted Warbs to have a 5 year contract and the keys to Narnia. Then we got one point out of 9 and lost two back to back games. I think we should sack Warbs if we lose against Bristol City or give him a 20 year contract if we win. Maybe 10 if we draw. Extend it if he wins the game after that or sack him again. In fact we should sack everyone, or keep them? You can't please any of the fans none of the time but you can annoy some of the fans all of the time. |  |
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| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 21:45 - Mar 4 with 2223 views | paulparker |
They had pace and aggression, we don’t have that
They have a manager who knows what he is doing and when to change it , we don’t have that
They have bought wisely with their budget, we haven’t
They have a game plan, we don’t
We played like an under 12s team last night , we was not unlucky , it was not a great game of football , nor were we in the game especially in the 2nd half
Good luck to them , they know what they are doing shame we still don’t |  |
| And Bowles is onside, Swinburne has come rushing out of his goal , what can Bowles do here , onto the left foot no, on to the right foot
That’s there that’s two, and that’s Bowles
Brian Moore
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| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 22:04 - Mar 4 with 2197 views | qprd |
Clive, I think Barnsley were very good, but Warbs got his tactics absolutely wrong on multiple counts.
-I'm all for rotating Dykes and Bonne, but he got the order wrong by starting Dykes against Barnsley and Bonne against BCFC. The pitch against BCFC was terrible, and they were a hoofballing route 1 side. I thought that game suited Dykes' physicality more.
Conversely, Barnsley's biggest weakness was the ball in behind. They played a kamikaze high line and we had chances behind their back 3 very early in the match. Bonne, for all his weaknesses, is very good at running behind defenses (see the 3 chances against Bournemouth, the thru ball that Field slipped him ystd that Bonne couldnt control), tho he does run offsides often. Had Bonne started, that option wouldve been available, which wouldve created scoring opportunities. Instead, we played Dykes and Austin, neither of whom make that run, forcing us to rely on hoofball/second ball winning for possession. Bonne starting wouldve pushed barnsleys line slightly deeper, allowing us more space to operate in midfield and probably more time on the ball... this issue was compounded by the wallace point as discussed below
-I'm ok with Wallace playing b/c i think he is more steady than Niko defensively (notwithstanding his error for the first goal ystd). But when we were down, why did Wallace continue playing? For all of Niko's shortcomings, he is an athlete, and provides something going forward. Barnsley played a high line which squeezed space for us to operate, and Wallace lacked hte pace to push that line back. Niko shouldve come in with the first batch of substitutes
Squad rotation is important, and i am all for it... but Warbs rly needs to put more thought into matchups when he decides to play Bonne v Dykes, and to a lesser extent, Wallace v Niko.....
there are other points to mention too, like whether, down 3-1, we needed 3 centerbacks if wallace was still on the pitch |  | | |
| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 22:18 - Mar 4 with 2187 views | qprd |
Barnsley are owned in part by Billy Beane, who is the guy Moneyball was written about, so not surprising that they were doing something different
watching barnsleys tactics actually reminded me of a sports analytics interview i watched a few years ago with Daryl Morey, who is basically the Billy Beane of the NBA and who is very close with Beane... his proposed football tactic which is called "launch and squash" is described below and is very similar to what Barnsley did ... it is a more sophisticated form of the POMO (position of max ppportunity) approach- oversimplified, you want to keep the ball out of your defensive half and in the other teams defensive half... the method to doing this is to play a high line, don’t play out of the back, have your back line and keeper hoof everything and the second the other team has the ball in their own defensive half, press them like mad
https://statsbomb.com/2021/02/
Barnsley also made an interesting sub of swapping out all 3 frontmen at once, which they also did in their prior match... the idea seemed to be bring on very fresh legs to sustain a high press immediately
also, barnsley have clearly found an arbitrage opportunity of the rule change to 5 subs rather than 3, which is very helpful given their style of play.... [Post edited 5 Mar 2021 7:23]
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| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 22:39 - Mar 4 with 2149 views | VancouverHoop |
Barnsley also made an interesting sub of swapping out all 3 frontmen at once, which they also did in their prior match... the idea seemed to be bring on very fresh legs to sustain a high press immediately
They do this every game, according to a Barnsley supporter, I linked to on the match thread:
"It's the same tactics every game with virtually the same players. We've six forwards. Three start the game, run themselves silly closing things down for sixty minutes, and then the other three come on and close things down for the rest of the game. Every other team knows what's coming and not a single one can do a thing about it (at the moment....)" | | | |
| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 23:45 - Mar 4 with 2078 views | CLAREMAN1995 |
Great report as usual Clive and a shout out for one of my favorite movies of all time Back To The Future and Doc Brown and MJ Fox when he was a young man and indeed myself too .
I did not see the match but going off the Forum its a pretty divided field of opinions but either way we lost and that is 2 in a row lets hope it does not continue towards our magnetic 6 |  | | |
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| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 08:31 - Mar 5 with 1932 views | ParkRoyalR |
| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 22:04 - Mar 4 by qprd |
Clive, I think Barnsley were very good, but Warbs got his tactics absolutely wrong on multiple counts.
-I'm all for rotating Dykes and Bonne, but he got the order wrong by starting Dykes against Barnsley and Bonne against BCFC. The pitch against BCFC was terrible, and they were a hoofballing route 1 side. I thought that game suited Dykes' physicality more.
Conversely, Barnsley's biggest weakness was the ball in behind. They played a kamikaze high line and we had chances behind their back 3 very early in the match. Bonne, for all his weaknesses, is very good at running behind defenses (see the 3 chances against Bournemouth, the thru ball that Field slipped him ystd that Bonne couldnt control), tho he does run offsides often. Had Bonne started, that option wouldve been available, which wouldve created scoring opportunities. Instead, we played Dykes and Austin, neither of whom make that run, forcing us to rely on hoofball/second ball winning for possession. Bonne starting wouldve pushed barnsleys line slightly deeper, allowing us more space to operate in midfield and probably more time on the ball... this issue was compounded by the wallace point as discussed below
-I'm ok with Wallace playing b/c i think he is more steady than Niko defensively (notwithstanding his error for the first goal ystd). But when we were down, why did Wallace continue playing? For all of Niko's shortcomings, he is an athlete, and provides something going forward. Barnsley played a high line which squeezed space for us to operate, and Wallace lacked hte pace to push that line back. Niko shouldve come in with the first batch of substitutes
Squad rotation is important, and i am all for it... but Warbs rly needs to put more thought into matchups when he decides to play Bonne v Dykes, and to a lesser extent, Wallace v Niko.....
there are other points to mention too, like whether, down 3-1, we needed 3 centerbacks if wallace was still on the pitch |
Great post, I think you could help a lot of our fans (minority on here) vast majority on Twitter, understand how + why sometimes we might be on the wrong side of the result we all want. Two great points + likewise thought Preston was game to rotate as Birmingham was an important game not to lose as is Wycombe next Tuesday. | | | |
| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 12:32 - Mar 5 with 1798 views | westberksr |
good stuff Clive; a far more enjoyable game of football as a viewing spectacle for neutrals and a harsh lesson to us regarding what you can do in this division.
of the past 3 games this one disappoints me the least as they properly facked us over, whereas the previous 2 were very winnable.
sometimes you have to sit back, admire the oppo and go back to the drawing board! |  | | |
| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 13:32 - Mar 5 with 1744 views | NorthantsHoop |
Totally agree Clive, thought Barnsley were excellent, we were just outplayed. |  | | |
| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 15:24 - Mar 5 with 1700 views | francisbowles |
| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 22:18 - Mar 4 by qprd |
Barnsley are owned in part by Billy Beane, who is the guy Moneyball was written about, so not surprising that they were doing something different
watching barnsleys tactics actually reminded me of a sports analytics interview i watched a few years ago with Daryl Morey, who is basically the Billy Beane of the NBA and who is very close with Beane... his proposed football tactic which is called "launch and squash" is described below and is very similar to what Barnsley did ... it is a more sophisticated form of the POMO (position of max ppportunity) approach- oversimplified, you want to keep the ball out of your defensive half and in the other teams defensive half... the method to doing this is to play a high line, don’t play out of the back, have your back line and keeper hoof everything and the second the other team has the ball in their own defensive half, press them like mad
https://statsbomb.com/2021/02/
Barnsley also made an interesting sub of swapping out all 3 frontmen at once, which they also did in their prior match... the idea seemed to be bring on very fresh legs to sustain a high press immediately
also, barnsley have clearly found an arbitrage opportunity of the rule change to 5 subs rather than 3, which is very helpful given their style of play.... [Post edited 5 Mar 2021 7:23]
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Good information and observations in your two posts, qprd. Stuff to digest and learn from. | | | |
| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 16:30 - Mar 5 with 1658 views | rrrspricey |
Looks like i'm very much in the minority here but i thought they were fcuking awful with their boot an chase anti-football.
Mrs P even commented about how many times i'm going to ask how the fcuk are getting beat by this shower of shìt and how they've won 6 on the spin? |  | | |
| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 16:28 - Mar 8 with 1449 views | Northernr |
Preston like what they see...
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| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 17:56 - Mar 8 with 1314 views | simmo |
| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 22:04 - Mar 4 by qprd |
Clive, I think Barnsley were very good, but Warbs got his tactics absolutely wrong on multiple counts.
-I'm all for rotating Dykes and Bonne, but he got the order wrong by starting Dykes against Barnsley and Bonne against BCFC. The pitch against BCFC was terrible, and they were a hoofballing route 1 side. I thought that game suited Dykes' physicality more.
Conversely, Barnsley's biggest weakness was the ball in behind. They played a kamikaze high line and we had chances behind their back 3 very early in the match. Bonne, for all his weaknesses, is very good at running behind defenses (see the 3 chances against Bournemouth, the thru ball that Field slipped him ystd that Bonne couldnt control), tho he does run offsides often. Had Bonne started, that option wouldve been available, which wouldve created scoring opportunities. Instead, we played Dykes and Austin, neither of whom make that run, forcing us to rely on hoofball/second ball winning for possession. Bonne starting wouldve pushed barnsleys line slightly deeper, allowing us more space to operate in midfield and probably more time on the ball... this issue was compounded by the wallace point as discussed below
-I'm ok with Wallace playing b/c i think he is more steady than Niko defensively (notwithstanding his error for the first goal ystd). But when we were down, why did Wallace continue playing? For all of Niko's shortcomings, he is an athlete, and provides something going forward. Barnsley played a high line which squeezed space for us to operate, and Wallace lacked hte pace to push that line back. Niko shouldve come in with the first batch of substitutes
Squad rotation is important, and i am all for it... but Warbs rly needs to put more thought into matchups when he decides to play Bonne v Dykes, and to a lesser extent, Wallace v Niko.....
there are other points to mention too, like whether, down 3-1, we needed 3 centerbacks if wallace was still on the pitch |
2 really good posts, qprd - especially the points made about picking the wrong horse for each course. Clive and I did say at the time of the Brum game that we thought it odd to play so direct - presumably because of the pitch - but then not have our only real target man on the bench.
Conversely the tactic of turning it in behind a Barnsley defence seems to work towards Bonnes only real defining attribute, assuming he can stay onside of course, which doesn't seem to happen much!
My assumption is that during congested periods of fixtures, MW's selections and subs lean a lot more towards sports science than anything tactical - unless absolutely necessary. He will see who is working to what capacity with high intensity runs and the like, then make the changes from there. That clearly works for the most part and I think it's the reason we've done so well with injuries so far, and I don't think it's a coincidence Chair had one of his better games (with a goal) after being rested for the first time. It's a difficult balance and obviously he's getting it mostly right, but I do think sometimes he's a little too focused on these things (sports science, the pitches, the fixtures) and we get in our own heads about them. A slight tweak to that thinking could and should have got 3 points against Birmingham - so hopefully that's lesson learned for next time. |  |
| ask Beavis I get nothing Butthead |
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| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 17:58 - Mar 8 with 1312 views | dutch |
| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 16:30 - Mar 5 by rrrspricey |
Looks like i'm very much in the minority here but i thought they were fcuking awful with their boot an chase anti-football.
Mrs P even commented about how many times i'm going to ask how the fcuk are getting beat by this shower of shìt and how they've won 6 on the spin? |
I'm with you, an abomination. | | | |
| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 19:02 - Mar 8 with 1214 views | Ned_Kennedys |
| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 17:58 - Mar 8 by dutch |
I'm with you, an abomination. |
abomination: a thing that causes disgust or loathing.
It's a football tactic: perhaps you are being a bit over the top and histrionic about this? |  | | |
| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 19:21 - Mar 8 with 1197 views | NgaiTahu_Hoop |
The comments against the swarming “anti- football” style of PNE are reminiscent of the attitudes expressed by some All Blacks fans back in the day of the English sides that featured The likes of Johnny Wilkinson etc . A lot of our fans would sneer at the forward based tactics that involved a grunty pack of monsters whose job it was to get Johnny close enough to kick some points. These forwards would strangle the life out of the opposition, ignore their own backs, and infuriate opposition fans.
Some of our All Black fans were most uncomplimentary and refused to give credit to the Poms for this but it was often just sour grapes because they dared to beat us occasionally. Guys like Martin Johnston etc are legends of the game and deserve respect. You can’t minimise their achievements because they don’t play the game the way you think it should be. I Don’t like losing but credit due where credits due. | | | |
| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report (n/t) on 19:47 - Mar 8 with 1156 views | dutch |
[Post edited 8 Mar 2021 19:49]
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| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 19:49 - Mar 8 with 1149 views | dutch |
| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 19:02 - Mar 8 by Ned_Kennedys |
abomination: a thing that causes disgust or loathing.
It's a football tactic: perhaps you are being a bit over the top and histrionic about this? |
I thought their style of football was loathsome, I hated it. They may be lovely people, nice to kids etc, but as a way to approach the beautiful game, for me it was perhaps the least attractive I have ever seen, not histrionic, just something I love debased. | | | |
| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 20:32 - Mar 8 with 1102 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 19:49 - Mar 8 by dutch |
I thought their style of football was loathsome, I hated it. They may be lovely people, nice to kids etc, but as a way to approach the beautiful game, for me it was perhaps the least attractive I have ever seen, not histrionic, just something I love debased. |
Well, I'm definitely travelling some of the road with you, dutch, as I didn't like their style of play either.
But I would still say that they played some nice stuff in our half, whereas Wimbledon, Beck's Cambridge and many Warnock teams played bogball in both halfs, so those teams remain the nadir for me. |  |
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| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 21:05 - Mar 8 with 1066 views | T_Block |
I agree totally with qprd (go back quite a few posts)
Spot on. | | | |
| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 19:57 - Mar 9 with 960 views | Nov77 |
They’ve invented a new game.........Bastardball |  |
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| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 20:06 - Mar 9 with 949 views | Match82 |
| Rangers run ragged by rampant Tykes — Report on 19:57 - Mar 9 by Nov77 |
They’ve invented a new game.........Bastardball |
18 headers in the first 39 seconds of that clip!
Impressive.
If they had kept that pace up all 90 minutes, that's 2500 headers. Maths. |  | | |
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