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Nice idea, although given the close proximity of the flats on the estate I think it would take a while to get that one through.
Also where are the funds for a new stadium / refurb coming from. Have Ruben et al got more money to burn??
Well, they have an assett in LR that would provide some substantial funds. They have deep pockets themselves, but I would imagine they would be looking for investment partners, depending on what could be agreed.
I don't think the financing would be a major issue, as long as the right development opportunity becomes available. I sense Ruben was talking about modest refurbishment proposals at LR. Why sink money into a dilapidated stadium?
No way would Ruben give any sensitive commercial information on a podcast. I trust him to do the right thing.
Reduce the width of South Africa Road by half (ie emergency vehicle access only)
Grew up and still live local and that road is a cut-through that goes nowhere (I could explain further but I'll spare you the detail) is very lightly trafficked and Bloemfontein Road via Westway offers alternative access to those who live local rather than use as a commuter rat-run (through a densely populated area).
So build new South Africa Road stand (similar logic to Fulham's new Riverside Stand) / move pitch / demolish + rebuild enlarged Ellerslie Road Stand with larger bars / catering facilities / retain Loft + School Ends stands more or less as is but give access to new bar + catering facilities in Ellerslie + South Africa Road.
AFC Wimbledon's new 10k stadium cost £ 30m, so £30m-£40m is not an unrealistic budget for 2 new enlarged stands to give us 25k odd capacity.
I'm no architect but those sketches indicate building upwards on both SAR and Ellerslie, which leads you into issue of light for the surrounding residents. They also talked about widening concourses, which is a necessary improvement. And even more important if you go to 3-4 levels. You have to be able to evacuate the ground quickly and safely, in case of emergencies. However, I struggle to see how it can be done on such a compact site. Even if it is doable, the costs are likely to be prohibitive. The only improvement I can really see, is to find a way of lifting the roofs and removing all the stanchions that mean 1/4 of the ground is limited views.
Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the Earth all one’s lifetime. (Mark Twain)
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I'm no architect but those sketches indicate building upwards on both SAR and Ellerslie, which leads you into issue of light for the surrounding residents. They also talked about widening concourses, which is a necessary improvement. And even more important if you go to 3-4 levels. You have to be able to evacuate the ground quickly and safely, in case of emergencies. However, I struggle to see how it can be done on such a compact site. Even if it is doable, the costs are likely to be prohibitive. The only improvement I can really see, is to find a way of lifting the roofs and removing all the stanchions that mean 1/4 of the ground is limited views.
Wouldn’t be cheap, but we could go down and create a bowl like MK. + I agree about the point of South Africa Rd, now that I don’t need it as a rat run. It sees little traffic during the day.
I don't think the owner of a football club would go on a podcast that is probably not listened to by anyone other than club fans to pitch a bluff to a sitting Council. Surely?
If i am not wrong, looking at the stadium on google map shadow falls to the pitch side and South Africa Road (north-south) and loftus road side stand and school end (east-west). While there is no problem of the issue of "right to light" along Ellerslie side (no shadow of stadium will be cast on the residences there) we need to be sensitive to the needs of residents on Loftus road. So not really a problem that cannot be overcome
Also, i agree planning is a nightmare but planning for a new stadium i think is the bigger monster in terms of planning issues (change of land use, access, nimbys, time, finance (cost of land - council implied not going to be free, cost of whole stadium etc), everything you reckon redeveloping Loftus Road are problems they are magnified 10 times with a brand new stadium and also unknown unexpected obstacles a new stadium on a new site will bring. Surely Council has to make a stand for the 100+ years old football club in their jurisdiction. Stay and redevelop OR move to a new site within the borough.
Ever so, with the "foreign owners" as highlighted by Council statement, i think the Council will be supportive of a redevelopment of Loftus Road more than new stadium on LCS site as foreigners selling prime land for profit will not be an issue. It is noted that if LCS is up for tender, it makes no sense to the owners to buy the land and build a new stadium where selling and redevelop Loftus Road commercially will not be able to finance it and still keep a profit.
Looking at Fulham, we probably need to give the Council something back like perhaps redevelop South Africa Road to a pedestrianised local road with community focus while we perhaps extend into the airspace above and also encroach to redesign/redevelop South Africa Stand?
I just don't see it, ParkRoyal. Wish I could as I;d love to stay at HQ.
Lighting to flats on SAR in the event of moving the SAR stand is a concern. Planning of any kind is a huge concern. Expanding Ellerslie would mean pushing it towards SAR which would mean rebuilding the School End and Loft. Therefore, we're effectively rebuilding all four stands. Still not convinced even that would give you enough hospitality income to get you significant outside business.
Four possibilities exist after this interview, that I can see:
1) This is a serious proposition by Gnanalingham, in which case he's at direct odds with Hoos. 2) This is a serious proposition by Gnanalingham and Hoos has changed his mind all of a sudden 3) This is Gnanalingham just pontificating, or 4) It's some sort of bluff to convince the Council to help us with LCS, but we have no leverage at all - "help us move or...ahm....we....won't move"
I'm not reassured by any of the four possibilities.
I don't see it either. Aside from the obvious barriers to development, redeveloping LR would be a very expensive proposition with limited scope for improvement and little ROI. With top class facilities already available in stadiums across London (Tottenham, Chelsea, Arsenal, West Ham), QPR would find it very difficult to compete with a 17.5k stadium offering limited facilities.
Whilst I understand the clamour to redevelop HQ, this is driven by emotion. Any decisions the board make on future stadia must come from the head, not the heart, and never stray from the ultimate objective; to make QPR FC sustainable in the long-term.
Great interview but I do wish that Charlie could ask a direct question without what seems like a 5 minute pre-amble before getting to it. It's a really unnecessary thing to do as he is a talented guy. Make the question clear and concise and he'd save about 10 mins per interview!
Yes, Charlie needs to learn to get to the point but he is young and will learn. I was far less impressed with Finney offering up random thoughts instead of asking direct questions.
For what it's worth Clive I thought you struck the best balance between preamble and questioning. However, having pooled your respective slots I can't help but think that the time wasted meant that some good questions went begging.
Still, at least it leaves scope for a sequel. Well done for getting the interview and thank you for sharing.
Erm...I thought “you can be the best player in the world, but if you’re not a good person please don’t come” was quite important...we take it as read now, but it took a while to get there.
Yes, Charlie needs to learn to get to the point but he is young and will learn. I was far less impressed with Finney offering up random thoughts instead of asking direct questions.
For what it's worth Clive I thought you struck the best balance between preamble and questioning. However, having pooled your respective slots I can't help but think that the time wasted meant that some good questions went begging.
Still, at least it leaves scope for a sequel. Well done for getting the interview and thank you for sharing.
Yeh I wouldn't disagree mate. I always beat myself up after interviews for questions that come to me later and I should have asked, and that's when it's just me and I've got an hour so it was particularly acute this time. I thought "if the club is stuck at Loftus Road, can't achieve sustainability and continues to lose £1.3m a month how long are you willing to keep funding that?" was a pretty obvious one in hindsight, though he probably would have straight batted it with some "long term commitment, look what we're spending on the training ground" sort of answer.
I'm sure there are more and I did find the format frustrating personally but if it's a choice between getting him for a limited time or not at all then I guess you take limited time.
Yeh I wouldn't disagree mate. I always beat myself up after interviews for questions that come to me later and I should have asked, and that's when it's just me and I've got an hour so it was particularly acute this time. I thought "if the club is stuck at Loftus Road, can't achieve sustainability and continues to lose £1.3m a month how long are you willing to keep funding that?" was a pretty obvious one in hindsight, though he probably would have straight batted it with some "long term commitment, look what we're spending on the training ground" sort of answer.
I'm sure there are more and I did find the format frustrating personally but if it's a choice between getting him for a limited time or not at all then I guess you take limited time.
You should cut yourself some slack, Clive. You're an excellent interviewer and, when it comes to asking the club the right questions, you're the last person who needs beating up.
Erm...I thought “you can be the best player in the world, but if you’re not a good person please don’t come” was quite important...we take it as read now, but it took a while to get there.
Related to that was the diversity issue.
Loved the approach when he said he, Tony and Amit realised that they hadn't actually put any 'positive discrimination' policies in place, just hired the right (good) people and trusted them to do the same.
And as if by magic, we have a diverse workforce - it really isn't as complicated as some make out.
Spurs managed to re-develop within a very compact space, its possible if the will is there
I know some have poo pooed the Michael Drain drawings but I actually think those plans look pretty conservative and do-able. My only issue if the extra height on the SA and Ellerslie Stands, but something has to give? If the council wont let us have a new site then they have to cut some slack with the current stadium... shirley???... Only other option is to move out of the borough. As Clive says how long will the £1.3M a month keep getting written off?
And possibly other planning reports on QPR redevelopment plan I am sure QPR management now and then have commissioned
Note that increasing the attendance or seating capacity is not a priority vis a vis return of investment but rather how to incorporate a multi use for Kiyan Prince Foundation Stadium and if we are clever some spaces can be multi-purpose to incorporate a host of uses. for example seating can be realigned and transformed to cater for a boxing match, concert etc. If it can incorporate some sort of every day uses?
- conference rooms / corporate boxes / premium hospitality lounges can go as one - a QPR museum cum superstore - community amenities like library (sports/local), gyms / fitness / therapy centre, function rooms for local residents / QPR fans, internet cafes (if that is still a thing) - restaurants / catering kitchen (for point 1 above) that is accessible and fronting / overlooking South Africa Road (but not on ground level - due to match days, large crowds) - buy the school end site or maybe incorporate the school with this purchase so school is incorporated into new design - with school providing another function for academy players in pursuing an alternate academic route - shop fronts for rental along South Africa Road / Loftus road which can capitalise on match days crowd for businesses etc - etc
maybe?
Personally i think if we can get a seating capacity of 20,000 would be a huge bonus for this boutique stadium, but 17,500 reduced capacity but with all the perks of financial sustainability build in would do QPR a world of good.
This michaeldrain plan ... really...? Those poor bastards at the top tiers would have really diabolical view for about 60% of the pitch ...
Really enjoyed that - Ruben seems like a bit of a dude - never heard him speak for that length of time. Personally, I'm ok with the style of the individual interviewers, they all did a decent job and contributed good questions.
Leaving aside the stadium stuff (I struggle to hang a shelf) the answers around culture, governance and 'betting the house' were very interesting, and the order that they had those elements in when they arrived seems very telling: betting the house before they'd looked at the culture and governance - I think that may be a bigger point than Ruben made it to be - wads of money being thrown all over the place at dodgy deals, all under the idea of "that's how football is". And he was quite open that it took them a good four years for the penny to drop.
They do sound, to me at least, like they've learnt a huge amount in recent years - painful lessons all round but important ones. And I think we can never underestimate the prestige that goes along with owning an English football club - "proper football" was I think what he and Tony called it when they ditched their Malaysian club ownership attempts - I'd speculate it's that that keeps them in it, continuing to invest, more than any kind of medium term financial opportunity. Long term may be different who really knows?
Yeh I wouldn't disagree mate. I always beat myself up after interviews for questions that come to me later and I should have asked, and that's when it's just me and I've got an hour so it was particularly acute this time. I thought "if the club is stuck at Loftus Road, can't achieve sustainability and continues to lose £1.3m a month how long are you willing to keep funding that?" was a pretty obvious one in hindsight, though he probably would have straight batted it with some "long term commitment, look what we're spending on the training ground" sort of answer.
I'm sure there are more and I did find the format frustrating personally but if it's a choice between getting him for a limited time or not at all then I guess you take limited time.
Absolutely, it made perfect sense to pool your resources if that increased the chances of securing an interview. 1 interview is certainly better than none.
It's tough because there were 3 of you representing different sites so the temptation is to just split the time in 3. However this results in different approaches and can affect the overall quality of the event IMHO it's better to agree one format and then the 3 of you agree one set of questions in advance. You can then nominate 1 chair to orchestrate proceedings, safe in the knowledge that all parties will get something out of he interview.
With all that being said, QPR has been notorious over the years for division amongst supporters and splintered fan groups. You should all be commended for putting individual agendas to one side and coming together to secure this interview. Yes, there were some warts but overall it was very enjoyable and a success.
With any luck you'll get another chance to speak with Ruben and you can field those questions that fell through the cracks.
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