| Johansen 10:18 - Apr 28 with 7414 views | CamberleyR |
Looking at when Johansen signed initially for Fulham and when he signed a new contract for them in 2019, I remain hopeful that he isn't on the sort of wage that many people think he is.
He signed a four year deal in summer 2016 when Fulham were in the Championship, admittedly they were receiving a second year of reducing parachute payments after relegation in 2013/14.
He signed for Fulham from Celtic who had signed him from Norway so he probably wasn't on massive money at Celtic although you'd think he would have increased his salary slightly signing for Fulham. He signed a new contract in summer 2019 after Fulham got promoted which expires 2022.
So for argument's sake let's say his deal at Celtic in 2014 as a then current Norway international was £6-7k a week? He signs for Fulham in the second year of parachute payments who you'd think would be trying to trim back the wage bill and not massively spend so let's say he doubles his wage signing for Fulham so £14k a week.
He signs his new Fulham deal in summer 2019 after relegation from the PL (although he'd been playing the second half of that season playing for West Brom on loan in the Champ). Fulham in receipt of a first year parachute payment of £40m although again you'd think they were being sensible with wages. New deal between £20-25k a week?
Is this being overly optimistic? Parker (if he remains manager) seems to like him as he played regularly last season so he may be offered a new deal in the summer if they are playing Championship football as seems likely. He's 30 now so his next contract will likely be his last one.
So let's assume he's on £25k per week currently, if we did sign him, do we commit £4.5-5m over three years (with nominal transfer fee + wages) to someone we wouldn't get anything back on? Personally, I think a Field/Johansen midfield pairing would potentially be our best pairing since Derry and Faurlin in the promotion season
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| Johansen on 08:27 - Apr 30 with 1482 views | hook_hoops |
| Johansen on 14:18 - Apr 28 by WestbourneR |
I'd let Chair go to keep Johansen. I feel he might have hit the ceiling of his development, very one sided and lacks real pace or incision. It'd be a real shame but he is replaceable - Thomas & Willock. I'm not sure Johansen is replaceable at our level. |
The understanding between Chair and Willock has given the team another dimension going forward and has been a highlight of the season for me. It would be unthinkable to let Chair go. |  | | |
| Johansen on 09:15 - Apr 30 with 1379 views | paulparker |
Ito back up camberleys post I’ve been told that SJ is not on the money that we think he is at Fulham
He has been a great signing and turned us around , alas I can see this being a Mark Kennedy situation where we lose out to another club offering more |  |
| And Bowles is onside, Swinburne has come rushing out of his goal , what can Bowles do here , onto the left foot no, on to the right foot
That’s there that’s two, and that’s Bowles
Brian Moore
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| Johansen on 09:26 - Apr 30 with 1367 views | rsonist |
| Johansen on 07:09 - Apr 30 by distortR |
at what point since he was injured and replaced, would you have played ltc, and who for?
really don't see it.
I had to take Brian McCarthy off my christmas card list over this issue.
Which was a palaver because first it meant creating one, and then striking, yes striking, him off. |
Gee I dunno, real tricky one this, I guess maybe all the times Johansen and Field weren't available to partner each other?
Anti-Carrollers are the most special snowflakes. |  | | |
| Johansen on 09:32 - Apr 30 with 1348 views | ed_83 |
We won’t be able to afford Johansen (or Austin for that matter) and the sooner we all accept it, the better. If by some insane turn of events one or both of them decides to give up millions of pounds to play for us then I’d be overjoyed, but beyond that extremely unlikely turn of events all the discussion about them is hot air.
Hopefully we’ll find another way to bring in that extra quality within our budget - I reckon our transfer business over the last 12 months should give us all confidence about our scouting - but I’m not losing any sleep over it. Even if we signed no-one and started next season with a midfield of Field and Amos behind Willock and Chair, we might not trouble the playoffs but should surely have enough to keep us out of trouble: a young, improving team playing enjoyable football and staying competitive on a limited budget has to be the primary focus for us as a club, rather than undermining our pay structure to squeeze in players we can’t afford.
Also for what it’s worth unless we already have our eyes on someone better I’d probably give Carroll another year, was one of our better performers first half of the season. [Post edited 30 Apr 2021 9:36]
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| Johansen on 10:07 - Apr 30 with 1302 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Johansen on 09:26 - Apr 30 by rsonist |
Gee I dunno, real tricky one this, I guess maybe all the times Johansen and Field weren't available to partner each other?
Anti-Carrollers are the most special snowflakes. |
I can guarantee you that that is the first time distortR has been called a snowflake!  |  |
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| Johansen on 10:15 - Apr 30 with 1269 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Johansen on 09:32 - Apr 30 by ed_83 |
We won’t be able to afford Johansen (or Austin for that matter) and the sooner we all accept it, the better. If by some insane turn of events one or both of them decides to give up millions of pounds to play for us then I’d be overjoyed, but beyond that extremely unlikely turn of events all the discussion about them is hot air.
Hopefully we’ll find another way to bring in that extra quality within our budget - I reckon our transfer business over the last 12 months should give us all confidence about our scouting - but I’m not losing any sleep over it. Even if we signed no-one and started next season with a midfield of Field and Amos behind Willock and Chair, we might not trouble the playoffs but should surely have enough to keep us out of trouble: a young, improving team playing enjoyable football and staying competitive on a limited budget has to be the primary focus for us as a club, rather than undermining our pay structure to squeeze in players we can’t afford.
Also for what it’s worth unless we already have our eyes on someone better I’d probably give Carroll another year, was one of our better performers first half of the season. [Post edited 30 Apr 2021 9:36]
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I agree with all of that, ed. The current squad minus Jojo and Austin should keep us out of trouble, as you say.
But if we are to continue to improve we do need to replace the two above with players who are better than what we otherwise would have. Replacing Johansen is the crucial move, i believe - a player who can get the ball quickly, accurately and consistently to Chair, Willock and the strikers. | |
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| Johansen on 10:26 - Apr 30 with 1239 views | rsonist |
| Johansen on 10:15 - Apr 30 by BrianMcCarthy |
I agree with all of that, ed. The current squad minus Jojo and Austin should keep us out of trouble, as you say.
But if we are to continue to improve we do need to replace the two above with players who are better than what we otherwise would have. Replacing Johansen is the crucial move, i believe - a player who can get the ball quickly, accurately and consistently to Chair, Willock and the strikers. |
If not Johansen then it will be someone else, you'd think. They wouldn't have been looking to invest in Whiteman first if cover for Amos' absence was the only consideration. | | | |
| Johansen on 10:31 - Apr 30 with 1220 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Johansen on 10:26 - Apr 30 by rsonist |
If not Johansen then it will be someone else, you'd think. They wouldn't have been looking to invest in Whiteman first if cover for Amos' absence was the only consideration. |
Good point.
I don't think we have a player like Johansen in our squad. | |
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| Johansen on 10:32 - Apr 30 with 1217 views | rsonist |
| Johansen on 10:26 - Apr 30 by rsonist |
If not Johansen then it will be someone else, you'd think. They wouldn't have been looking to invest in Whiteman first if cover for Amos' absence was the only consideration. |
Whiteman who incidentally has had a mare at Preston so far, alongside Brighton loanee Jayson Molumby who many - myself included - were cross we weren't in for in January, and would have preferred to SJ at the time in fact. Good players, bad side, fine margins. | | | |
| Johansen on 10:40 - Apr 30 with 1186 views | Myke |
| Johansen on 10:26 - Apr 30 by rsonist |
If not Johansen then it will be someone else, you'd think. They wouldn't have been looking to invest in Whiteman first if cover for Amos' absence was the only consideration. |
I think a lot of people are missing the point about Carroll and are judging him when playing in a poor team, or, worse still, judging him on his previous stint with the club. If Carroll had a quality mid-fielder beside him (say Field for example), and quality players in front of him looking for the ball (Willock and Chair) a confident, free-scoring striker (Dykes) and a solid back three behind him, he would flourish. He was already one of our better players in the first half of the season, despite us being poor and bereft of confidence. | | | |
| Johansen on 10:52 - Apr 30 with 1162 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Johansen on 10:40 - Apr 30 by Myke |
I think a lot of people are missing the point about Carroll and are judging him when playing in a poor team, or, worse still, judging him on his previous stint with the club. If Carroll had a quality mid-fielder beside him (say Field for example), and quality players in front of him looking for the ball (Willock and Chair) a confident, free-scoring striker (Dykes) and a solid back three behind him, he would flourish. He was already one of our better players in the first half of the season, despite us being poor and bereft of confidence. |
I'm a fan of Carroll, Myke - hence distortR knocking me off his imaginary Christmas card list - and I agree with your analysis of him. When he got injured we missed him immediately until Johansen came in.
I do think, though, that if we are to continue to improve we'd need someone who can get the ball through oppo midfields as quickly, accurately and consistently as Johansen can. As much as I like Carroll, I'm not sure he's quite at that very high level. | |
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| Johansen on 10:52 - Apr 30 with 1160 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| Johansen on 10:40 - Apr 30 by Myke |
I think a lot of people are missing the point about Carroll and are judging him when playing in a poor team, or, worse still, judging him on his previous stint with the club. If Carroll had a quality mid-fielder beside him (say Field for example), and quality players in front of him looking for the ball (Willock and Chair) a confident, free-scoring striker (Dykes) and a solid back three behind him, he would flourish. He was already one of our better players in the first half of the season, despite us being poor and bereft of confidence. |
Totally agree.
I’d also add that his first stint with us wasn’t that bad either but if your game is keeping possession and the players around you are too lazy or legless to move into space or pull players away for you it’s difficult. Same goes for the Pirate.
Both went on to have great careers away from QPR by the way. Maybe sometimes it’s the club and not the player that is the wrong fit. |  | | |
| Johansen on 11:05 - Apr 30 with 1116 views | PlanetHonneywood |
| Johansen on 10:52 - Apr 30 by BrianMcCarthy |
I'm a fan of Carroll, Myke - hence distortR knocking me off his imaginary Christmas card list - and I agree with your analysis of him. When he got injured we missed him immediately until Johansen came in.
I do think, though, that if we are to continue to improve we'd need someone who can get the ball through oppo midfields as quickly, accurately and consistently as Johansen can. As much as I like Carroll, I'm not sure he's quite at that very high level. |
If I had all that around me, I too would be Andrea Pirlo! |  |
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| Johansen on 11:08 - Apr 30 with 1121 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Johansen on 11:05 - Apr 30 by PlanetHonneywood |
If I had all that around me, I too would be Andrea Pirlo! |
You're not Andrea Pirlo? | |
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| Johansen on 11:38 - Apr 30 with 1080 views | TacticalR |
Hasn't how effective Johansen has been really shown the limitations of players like Carroll and Amos? |  |
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| Johansen on 12:47 - Apr 30 with 1021 views | dmm |
Carroll can pass well, though not quite as well as Johansen. He doesn't have the defensive game Johansen has, who has screened the back three on his own in some recent games. Carroll, however, can get bullied out of a game.
That said, pairing him with Field could work. |  | | |
| Johansen on 13:20 - Apr 30 with 965 views | rsonist |
I wouldn't go so far as to say with any certainty that LTC would flourish - we would lose a lot of (what the kids like to call) verticality with him partnering Field - but I do believe is he is a known quantity that would give us a very decent quality and relatively inexpensive bit of squad flexibility during what may well be period of transitional uncertainty in the position.
Which is to say: question mark remains over Amos positionally, question mark over how strongly he returns; question mark over Thomas in the centre; question mark over Bettache and Duke-McKenna, and whether even if they've got the talent that it won't be better developed on loan rather than bits and bobs filling in the gaps; Field's quality not in doubt, but it will effectively be a first full season ahead in a lead role and it's not like he's never been injured either.
I'd back us on recent form to find the raw talent to replace Johansen, but as we've seen this season you might well need an environment to allow learning on the job else fine margins snowball negatively. You can argue - regardless of the argument about his contribution within his known limitations - that it didn't appear LTC wasn't any help with that in first half of the season, and you'd be right. I'm not so sure however that Field wouldn't also have struggled were he in Carroll's stead during that period and that those fine margins would have turned out dramatically differently. And that's what's ahead of us now. | | | |
| Johansen on 13:30 - Apr 30 with 944 views | rsonist |
What would have been ideal is to have seen how Carroll could play in this side, with a potent box to box in Johansen, and possibly include all three with Field in some sort of tactical tweak in certain situations. Then we could speculate about flourishing. I wonder if we'll see it in the last two games. | | | |
| Johansen on 15:07 - Apr 30 with 850 views | gazza1 |
| Johansen on 10:40 - Apr 30 by Myke |
I think a lot of people are missing the point about Carroll and are judging him when playing in a poor team, or, worse still, judging him on his previous stint with the club. If Carroll had a quality mid-fielder beside him (say Field for example), and quality players in front of him looking for the ball (Willock and Chair) a confident, free-scoring striker (Dykes) and a solid back three behind him, he would flourish. He was already one of our better players in the first half of the season, despite us being poor and bereft of confidence. |
But he wasn't ever of our best players..........he did very little apart from sitting in front of the back players. How many goals did he get??, how many crosses?? how many assists?? how many tackles did he make?? - answer - not a lot. Lacks pace & aggresion. All he done was parade his skills passing 10 yards, getting it back, passing it again, getting it back again!!!!, looking good to many but not too me....all in our defensive third when he had time and space and no pressure. We are in the Championship and that is not what is required from our midfielders generally. He has moved around all his career stealing a wage!!!, more clubs than a golfer has!!!
He should not be here next season if we have got any ambition. [Post edited 30 Apr 2021 15:09]
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| Johansen on 17:50 - Apr 30 with 732 views | distortR |
| Johansen on 15:07 - Apr 30 by gazza1 |
But he wasn't ever of our best players..........he did very little apart from sitting in front of the back players. How many goals did he get??, how many crosses?? how many assists?? how many tackles did he make?? - answer - not a lot. Lacks pace & aggresion. All he done was parade his skills passing 10 yards, getting it back, passing it again, getting it back again!!!!, looking good to many but not too me....all in our defensive third when he had time and space and no pressure. We are in the Championship and that is not what is required from our midfielders generally. He has moved around all his career stealing a wage!!!, more clubs than a golfer has!!!
He should not be here next season if we have got any ambition. [Post edited 30 Apr 2021 15:09]
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don't forget that he often fades badly as well..................
However, as Myke says, if he has better players then him around him to do all the things he can't, he'll probably look better.
Brian, your card would have had snowflakes on it. | | | |
| Johansen on 17:57 - Apr 30 with 713 views | distortR |
| Johansen on 10:52 - Apr 30 by BazzaInTheLoft |
Totally agree.
I’d also add that his first stint with us wasn’t that bad either but if your game is keeping possession and the players around you are too lazy or legless to move into space or pull players away for you it’s difficult. Same goes for the Pirate.
Both went on to have great careers away from QPR by the way. Maybe sometimes it’s the club and not the player that is the wrong fit. |
erm, since he started playing, we've played more premiership games then he has.
i wouldn't describe his career as great or bad. | | | |
| Johansen on 18:13 - Apr 30 with 688 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| Johansen on 17:57 - Apr 30 by distortR |
erm, since he started playing, we've played more premiership games then he has.
i wouldn't describe his career as great or bad. |
I did say since they left!
LTC played in a UEFA Cup last 16 and finished 3rd in the Premiership! [Post edited 30 Apr 2021 18:16]
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| Johansen on 18:18 - Apr 30 with 676 views | distortR |
| Johansen on 18:13 - Apr 30 by BazzaInTheLoft |
I did say since they left!
LTC played in a UEFA Cup last 16 and finished 3rd in the Premiership! [Post edited 30 Apr 2021 18:16]
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yeah, he started 4 league matches for them 2015/16.
In his favour, his wiki page said he scored from the bench for swansea, which is quite impressive! | | | |
| Johansen on 18:19 - Apr 30 with 671 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| Johansen on 18:18 - Apr 30 by distortR |
yeah, he started 4 league matches for them 2015/16.
In his favour, his wiki page said he scored from the bench for swansea, which is quite impressive! |
You forgot banging in the winner against Monaco I see! 😆
He also got promoted with Swansea soon after didn’t he?
Edit: no he didn’t. [Post edited 30 Apr 2021 18:21]
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