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From Ireland manager Halgrimson “He’s Development at Queen’s Park has been growing” Queens park ! Economy of laungage?
Been watching him for a year apparantly maybe Jimmy Dunne had a word in his ear . Jimmy's chances went up seeing Egan and Coleman recalled and Collins having a bad spell as well as being very slow. Every ROI supporter praying Kelleher survives Brentfords game this weekend he is the most important player these next 2 games IMO.
Imagine being a player who has played underage for your chosen country all the way through the ranks, hoping against hope that you could become a senior player. To get the prized senior cap.
Then a player who has played for another country from U-15 all the way through every level, and even captained that country but can't get into their senior team is suddenly allowed to change his nationality.
Just allowed.
He plays in the same position as you.
But it's ok. It's within the rules. His team-mate - your team-mate - has talked him into it.
Your national team manager was part of it all.
How is this a nice story? How is this fair? How in the name of God is this National Sports?
I've been sick of this for decades, mind you, but this...this is just too bizarre.
"The opposite of love, after all, is not hate, but indifference."
Been watching him for a year apparantly maybe Jimmy Dunne had a word in his ear . Jimmy's chances went up seeing Egan and Coleman recalled and Collins having a bad spell as well as being very slow. Every ROI supporter praying Kelleher survives Brentfords game this weekend he is the most important player these next 2 games IMO.
Could be wrong but this is a one off game rather than two legs. Lose and we’re out .
Imagine being a player who has played underage for your chosen country all the way through the ranks, hoping against hope that you could become a senior player. To get the prized senior cap.
Then a player who has played for another country from U-15 all the way through every level, and even captained that country but can't get into their senior team is suddenly allowed to change his nationality.
Just allowed.
He plays in the same position as you.
But it's ok. It's within the rules. His team-mate - your team-mate - has talked him into it.
Your national team manager was part of it all.
How is this a nice story? How is this fair? How in the name of God is this National Sports?
I've been sick of this for decades, mind you, but this...this is just too bizarre.
It's not right, but them's the rules.
The guy who's had to be left out so the English guy can take his place will be, and should be, p1ssed off.
"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the Earth all one's lifetime." (Mark Twain)
Find me on twitter @derbyhoop and now on Bluesky
Understand Brian's and others sentiments, but think it's harsh to hold players to decisions made when they were children / teenagers. We are assuming it's just done in self interest but perhaps HV has a very strong Irish affinity and it was his family that influenced him to play for England. Unlikely I know, but possible. Also its a professional game and they are getting paid so it's never just about love for your country.
If my daughter was good enough to play for football for Ireland . I would be the proudest man alive . She got her Irish passport through my dad as I’m not Irish born although I was raised there for my formative years and still have a broad Irish accent. She’s very proud of her Irish roots and regularly travels to see her 13 or so first cousins there. It’s a hoary subject and it’s getting a lot of coverage on social media. Ireland has a had huge influx of immigrants which from what I can see is not dealing with particularly well and is showing through in some of the comments. I wish him well .
He could at least have called it “hishtory”. Caol le caol…
Plenty of people won’t like it on both sides of the sea, but it’s perfectly possible to feel proudly English AND Irish.
"Plenty of people won’t like it on both sides of the sea, but it’s perfectly possible to feel proudly English AND Irish."
100%. I count myself as one of them.
I would have no problem with him switching nations, just not at 23, and not after he's captained one of them.
I don't think it's right, I don't think it's fair, and I think that Ireland should have enough pride to say "thanks, my man, but we're going with those who chose us as Plan A".
"The opposite of love, after all, is not hate, but indifference."
"Plenty of people won’t like it on both sides of the sea, but it’s perfectly possible to feel proudly English AND Irish."
100%. I count myself as one of them.
I would have no problem with him switching nations, just not at 23, and not after he's captained one of them.
I don't think it's right, I don't think it's fair, and I think that Ireland should have enough pride to say "thanks, my man, but we're going with those who chose us as Plan A".
Think you talk a lot of sense here Brian... And I know this is a football forum...
But criticism of this selection by Ireland (as well as the stick given to Rice and Grealish) does stick in the craw somewhat given Ireland has built pretty much their entire rugby team around James Lowe, Jamison Gibson Park and Bundee Aki. None of whom had ever stepped foot in Ireland before they started playing their club rugby there. Not forgetting of course that James Lowe was capped by New Zealand Maori AGAINST the British and Irish Lions. Compared to those three Irish heroes, Vale would bleed green.
Could be wrong but this is a one off game rather than two legs. Lose and we’re out .
Yes I read that line back and left out the most important part ( if we win the first game away ) Paddyhoops which of course is not given. There would be penalty shootouts if needed and Kelleher is superb there also .Playing Leeds at Elland Road not ideal this weekend he will be busy
Think you talk a lot of sense here Brian... And I know this is a football forum...
But criticism of this selection by Ireland (as well as the stick given to Rice and Grealish) does stick in the craw somewhat given Ireland has built pretty much their entire rugby team around James Lowe, Jamison Gibson Park and Bundee Aki. None of whom had ever stepped foot in Ireland before they started playing their club rugby there. Not forgetting of course that James Lowe was capped by New Zealand Maori AGAINST the British and Irish Lions. Compared to those three Irish heroes, Vale would bleed green.
[Post edited 20 Mar 13:01]
Don’t have a big problem with it. The great England cricket teams had Alan lamb and the late Robin Smith playing for them . Englands best one day captain was Eoin Morgan . If my memory serves me well probably best not mention Irish rugby to Brian . He’s not a fan of.
His selection has caused quite a stir here in Dublin. I have been asked by several friends and colleagues about him over the past 24 hours.
I took the opportunity to point out that there aren't any Arsenal, Liverpool, Man Utd or Leeds players on the Irish squad, but there are two QPR players. A friend replied saying that all of those are Premiership sides, while QPR are 16th in the Championship. That's probably an accurate reflection on the quality of the Irish team these days.
Imagine being a player who has played underage for your chosen country all the way through the ranks, hoping against hope that you could become a senior player. To get the prized senior cap.
Then a player who has played for another country from U-15 all the way through every level, and even captained that country but can't get into their senior team is suddenly allowed to change his nationality.
Just allowed.
He plays in the same position as you.
But it's ok. It's within the rules. His team-mate - your team-mate - has talked him into it.
Your national team manager was part of it all.
How is this a nice story? How is this fair? How in the name of God is this National Sports?
I've been sick of this for decades, mind you, but this...this is just too bizarre.
I certainly see where you are coming from, Brian and there are truths in your views. I feel that Vale should be made earn his place in the squad, by strong club performances over a period of time, like any other player. He wasn’t even ‘Irish’ when Parrott toe-poked the ball in the Hungarian net and now he is denying some other player a place in the squad. This in itself could foster unrest within the squad and is not a wise move by the manager I feel. Moreover, this smacks of an era when we were so desperate for players that we grabbed anyone who had a sniff of ‘Oirishness’ about them. Overall, we have quite a well balanced squad, and Vale is not going to enhance it significantly. I am afraid it all comes down to quality in the end. If Vale was ‘too good’ for us then he would not have swapped allegiance , he would have persevered with getting into the English set -up. Likewise, people can say what you like about Rice and Grealish being born in England, but like Vale, they represented their Country (RoI) all up along the grades. The only reason they opted to play for England is because they were good enough to do so and knew they would earn senior caps. If they were Vale standard, and hadn’t a hope in hell of being capped at senior level by England, they would have stayed in the Irish camp. Nothing to do with loyalty or ‘blood’, but all about opportunity.
Imagine being a player who has played underage for your chosen country all the way through the ranks, hoping against hope that you could become a senior player. To get the prized senior cap.
Then a player who has played for another country from U-15 all the way through every level, and even captained that country but can't get into their senior team is suddenly allowed to change his nationality.
Just allowed.
He plays in the same position as you.
But it's ok. It's within the rules. His team-mate - your team-mate - has talked him into it.
Your national team manager was part of it all.
How is this a nice story? How is this fair? How in the name of God is this National Sports?
I've been sick of this for decades, mind you, but this...this is just too bizarre.
Totally get where you're coming from. I've never been a fan of this process. It feels a bit like when Jack Charlton was in charge for the 1994 competition and, once England were out of the picture, half a dozen players remembered that their Granny once enjoyed half a Guinness and started learning the national anthem. Or when Jamaica qualified for France 98.
Full disclosure, I have no skin in this game other than my missus being Canadian and me laughing about Marc Bircham signing up with them just before they headed out to the Caribbean.
Coming soon: 'Ireland Announce New Forward For WC26: "I'm delighted to be here", says Ebere O'Eze...'
'What do we want? We don't know! When do we want it? Now!'
Declan Rice played for Ireland U17, U19 and U21. He also made 3 senior appearances albeit in international friendlies. Arguably a bigger loss to the Irish team under the rules than any benefit they might accrue from the reverse.
Imagine being a player who has played underage for your chosen country all the way through the ranks, hoping against hope that you could become a senior player. To get the prized senior cap.
Then a player who has played for another country from U-15 all the way through every level, and even captained that country but can't get into their senior team is suddenly allowed to change his nationality.
Just allowed.
He plays in the same position as you.
But it's ok. It's within the rules. His team-mate - your team-mate - has talked him into it.
Your national team manager was part of it all.
How is this a nice story? How is this fair? How in the name of God is this National Sports?
I've been sick of this for decades, mind you, but this...this is just too bizarre.
Interestingly, at least one sport - table tennis - imposes restrictions on players who change nationality.
I realised this when Zhu Yuling won a major international tournament and then wasn't even in the draw for the next big competition, on the basis that she had switched from China to Macau.
The rule is as follows (this is paraphrased):
According to the "naturalization ban", players who change associations over the age of 21 are permanently banned from participating in the three major events of the Olympics, the World Table Tennis Championships, and the World Cup.
"Things had started becoming increasingly desperate at Loftus Road but QPR have been handed a massive lifeline and the place has absolutely erupted. it's carnage. It's bedlam. It's 1-1."
Don’t have a big problem with it. The great England cricket teams had Alan lamb and the late Robin Smith playing for them . Englands best one day captain was Eoin Morgan . If my memory serves me well probably best not mention Irish rugby to Brian . He’s not a fan of.
Smith, Lamb and Morgan all had English parents. As did Kevin Pieterson and Dylan Hartley. So they're comparable to Vale. None of them are comparable selections to the three I mentioned.
"Plenty of people won’t like it on both sides of the sea, but it’s perfectly possible to feel proudly English AND Irish."
100%. I count myself as one of them.
I would have no problem with him switching nations, just not at 23, and not after he's captained one of them.
I don't think it's right, I don't think it's fair, and I think that Ireland should have enough pride to say "thanks, my man, but we're going with those who chose us as Plan A".
I can see where you're coming from in this particular instance. It feels like the old university admissions form where you had to select a first, second and third choice. When the first and second send rejection letters suddenly your third choice was always the place you had your heart set on.
Genuine question. I note from a previous post you've felt this way for decades. Did that stem from the Jack Charlton era? Were Irish folk initially sceptical of the appointment of an Englishman at the helm and the subsequent recruitment of a number of foreign-born players? Did their success on the pitch evaporate any misgivings?
Smith, Lamb and Morgan all had English parents. As did Kevin Pieterson and Dylan Hartley. So they're comparable to Vale. None of them are comparable selections to the three I mentioned.
All the home nations have taken advantage of the “ residency “ rules . Pretty certain Billy vunapola did when playing for England . He’s brother played for wales I think. I agree Ireland have, in particular gone over the top with the amount they’ve had .
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