| Todd Kane and Brentford on 12:37 - Jun 21 with 2861 views | BucksRanger |
Todd Kane called a foreign player 'foreign', factually Todd was 100% correct. I have a foreign surname and have also been called 'foreign' from time to time even though I was born in England. Should I be trying to have people arrested or banned from working for that, no I bloody well shouldn't. It's ridiculous. The case for Todd Kane being xenophobic is no way near proved because of one solitary outburst. There is no proof that he is prejudiced against people from other countries which is what xenophobia means, all that outburst tells you is that he was angry at a single foreign individual for a moment in time.
Jesus Christ this country is completely mental these days. You now have permission to all call me a foreign or English bigot for my belief and I won't take umbrage. |  | |  |
| Todd Kane and Brentford on 12:40 - Jun 21 with 2855 views | Spaghetti_Hoops |
| Todd Kane and Brentford on 10:24 - Jun 21 by BrianMcCarthy |
I've always agreed with you, Dave, about the interview - seemed like we would have forgiven Austin (for example) for that.
The xenophobia is a deal-breaker, though. Can't be kept after that. |
Woke nonsense. |  | | |
| Todd Kane and Brentford on 12:43 - Jun 21 with 2829 views | Snipper |
| Todd Kane and Brentford on 12:19 - Jun 21 by BrianMcCarthy |
I'm not holier than thou at all, Snipper. I've done things I'm deeply ashamed of, that make me shudder when I remember them, and I've accepted the consequences.
I don't think this is about cancel culture - this is me being old-fashioned by saying that there are consequences to actions and they need to be faced up to.
And I don't think it's got anything to do with being working class - my parents are working class - one has used xenophobic language in the past, the other never has. I have no idea if Kane is working class, middle class or has a two-page entry in Debrett's Peerage.
And I don't think it's got anything to do with being lefty. I have right-wing friends who dislike xenophobia as much as i do.
I just don't think he should play for our club again, I think that's the appropriate reaction to his actions, and I know others think differently, and that's fine. |
I’m on about cancel culture in general. Twitter is nothing but bad news.
I don’t know about you, but I think in the last two years or so, the world has become a poorer place. Everybody has to walk on eggshells when they speak on any subject in case they’re accused of upsetting someone.
As Ricky Gervais said a while back, ‘just because you’re offended by something, it doesn’t mean you’re right.’ [Post edited 21 Jun 2021 12:47]
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| Todd Kane and Brentford on 12:51 - Jun 21 with 2774 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Todd Kane and Brentford on 12:43 - Jun 21 by Snipper |
I’m on about cancel culture in general. Twitter is nothing but bad news.
I don’t know about you, but I think in the last two years or so, the world has become a poorer place. Everybody has to walk on eggshells when they speak on any subject in case they’re accused of upsetting someone.
As Ricky Gervais said a while back, ‘just because you’re offended by something, it doesn’t mean you’re right.’ [Post edited 21 Jun 2021 12:47]
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You're not the only person saying that, Snipper. It's a common enough feeling.
I don't really have an opinion on it in general terms, being honest. It doesn't seem to affect life here in Ireland as much, or maybe just doesn't affect my life, I'm not sure which. |  |
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| Todd Kane and Brentford on 12:54 - Jun 21 with 2752 views | Ranger_Things |
| Todd Kane and Brentford on 12:02 - Jun 21 by Snipper |
No, I wasn’t asking that. You’ve obviously led a holier than thou life than most people.
I said things are said in the heat of battle, things you regret. So you’re saying that a player who said something in the heat of battle shouldn’t play for our club anymore? They’re working class football players, not robots.
So, with your argument, the English cricketer, Ollie Robinson, shouldn’t play for England again due to historic tweets when he was 17/18.
People all over are being cancelled or losing their livelihoods because of the barking mad lefty culture we live in. People losing jobs for their belief that there’s only two genders for example. Well I for one am bloody sick of it. [Post edited 21 Jun 2021 12:04]
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People are losing jobs for their belief that there’s only two genders? |  | | |
| Todd Kane and Brentford on 12:54 - Jun 21 with 2750 views | Superhoop83 |
| Todd Kane and Brentford on 12:43 - Jun 21 by Snipper |
I’m on about cancel culture in general. Twitter is nothing but bad news.
I don’t know about you, but I think in the last two years or so, the world has become a poorer place. Everybody has to walk on eggshells when they speak on any subject in case they’re accused of upsetting someone.
As Ricky Gervais said a while back, ‘just because you’re offended by something, it doesn’t mean you’re right.’ [Post edited 21 Jun 2021 12:47]
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Cancel culture is a confection of the right wing media, designed to enrage the Daily Mail brigade who like to believe that "you can't say anything any more".
You cannot "cancel" people who exist or events that have happened and if you dig into media reports and (God help us all) Twitter news you won't find people being sacked for referring incorrectly to a person's gender.
The notion that anyone on the left wing is calling the shots is ludicrous, especially with this ****ing Government in charge.
All of that said, I am in the neutral camp when it comes to Todd Kane. He shouldn't have said what he said but it is not a reason to bomb him out of the club. His footballing ability and his attitude on the other hand... |  |
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| Todd Kane and Brentford on 12:57 - Jun 21 with 2720 views | A40Bosh |
| Todd Kane and Brentford on 12:43 - Jun 21 by Snipper |
I’m on about cancel culture in general. Twitter is nothing but bad news.
I don’t know about you, but I think in the last two years or so, the world has become a poorer place. Everybody has to walk on eggshells when they speak on any subject in case they’re accused of upsetting someone.
As Ricky Gervais said a while back, ‘just because you’re offended by something, it doesn’t mean you’re right.’ [Post edited 21 Jun 2021 12:47]
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Snipper, I agree and have some (heated) arguments with my 3 daughters on this slide in to cancel culture and lack of debate. I get the impression that a group of people pick up on a theme and it quickly becomes a cause (not saying whether it should or shouldn't be a cause etc) and then on social media there gets to a tipping point where you are immediately shut down if you counter their argument. There is no debate, no argument or "agree to disagree" you are shot down and the insults and knives come out.
Even stupid things like on FB on a community group I dared to question whether "complaining to the school" about the fact that a primary school aged kid WHO WAS WITH THEIR MOTHER AT THE TIME, ran in to a woman's driveway being chased by a friend and committed the crime of slapping his hands on her car bonnet to stop himself. The personal abuse I got when I tried to argue that the school has enough to contend with with stuff that happens within their sphere of influence both inside and outside the school gates, without having to deal with such minor misdemeanours. You would have thought I had murdered someone rather than just question the hysterical reactions and demands the school takes the mother to task for allowing a child to run in to a driveway two streets away from the school. Really nasty insults about what I must be like as a person and they hoped I never had kids (way too late for that now) etc... |  |
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| Todd Kane and Brentford on 12:57 - Jun 21 with 2717 views | danehoop |
| Todd Kane and Brentford on 12:43 - Jun 21 by Snipper |
I’m on about cancel culture in general. Twitter is nothing but bad news.
I don’t know about you, but I think in the last two years or so, the world has become a poorer place. Everybody has to walk on eggshells when they speak on any subject in case they’re accused of upsetting someone.
As Ricky Gervais said a while back, ‘just because you’re offended by something, it doesn’t mean you’re right.’ [Post edited 21 Jun 2021 12:47]
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Not sure if this is someone being ironic, in pointing that being offended doesn't make them right, when they clearly seem to be offended. Not sure either about the advisability either of using Ricky Gervais quotes is necessarily a massive reinforcement of an opinion.
Hey Ho, everyone has an opinion and so on.
Cant help but think this thread is about to be closed down before too long |  |
| Never knowingly understood |
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| Todd Kane and Brentford on 13:07 - Jun 21 with 2649 views | Snipper |
| Todd Kane and Brentford on 12:54 - Jun 21 by Superhoop83 |
Cancel culture is a confection of the right wing media, designed to enrage the Daily Mail brigade who like to believe that "you can't say anything any more".
You cannot "cancel" people who exist or events that have happened and if you dig into media reports and (God help us all) Twitter news you won't find people being sacked for referring incorrectly to a person's gender.
The notion that anyone on the left wing is calling the shots is ludicrous, especially with this ****ing Government in charge.
All of that said, I am in the neutral camp when it comes to Todd Kane. He shouldn't have said what he said but it is not a reason to bomb him out of the club. His footballing ability and his attitude on the other hand... |
I’ve voted Labour since I’ve been old enough to vote, but in my opinion, Jeremy Corbyn was the worst thing to happen to Labour. It allowed Momentum and o get a foothold in the Labour Party, and they took it backwards.
I work for London Underground, and I’ve been a member of the RMT for nearly 29 years. I’ve seen first hand what happens to people when they dare speak out against the lefts narrative. You’re called a racist, xenophobe, misogynist etc etc………
I honestly don’t know how you think it’s down to Daily Mail readers. [Post edited 21 Jun 2021 13:10]
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| Todd Kane and Brentford on 13:10 - Jun 21 with 2639 views | ThrowACherry |
Pretty simple really. Is being xenophobic or racist acceptable - no. If someone says something xenophobic or racist should there be consequences - yes. I think (hope) we can all agree racism and xenophobia is not ok.
In order to drive out racism in society you need to educate people first and have a zero tolerance approach when it crops up. You can't be saying that's only a bit racist and this is more racist etc etc. Yes people say disgusting things to people all the time, it doesn't make it ok. I'm sure we've all done something we regret. And I'm pretty sure everyone knows what is not ok to say. It's really not hard to just not say them... If they don't, your're gonna need to educate them (sorry if that sounds patronising) and dish out an appropriate punishment.
Thankfully people who are on the receiving end are getting more of a voice these days and we should be swallowing our pride, opening our minds, listening and changing. Something that seems in short supply atm.
In the context of previous bans/things you heard back in the day it seems harsh but there has to be serious punishments otherwise nothing will change. Personally in my opinion I'm proud of QPR these last few years. We can only do what we can as individuals, and I think on this the club are mostly getting it right. | | | |
| Todd Kane and Brentford on 13:11 - Jun 21 with 2623 views | dannyblue |
There was an ill-tempered football match between Glasgow Rangers and Slavia Prague. Ondrej Kudela was given a ten match ban for racist behaviour after he whispered to Glen Kamara “you’re a monkey, you’re a fúcking monkey, and you know you are”. Kamara was given a three match ban for assaulting Kudela in the tunnel after the game. In the same match Kemar Roofe was sent off and given a four match ban after he kicked the Prague goalkeeper in the face, fracturing his skull and leaving him needing 10 stitches.
Would you rather be subject to a racist insult, be assaulted in the tunnel after a game, or have your skull fractured?
With the length of bans – 10, 3, and 4 respectively – UEFA has shown its preference.
Obviously the offences belong to different categories. One could be accidental or negligent, two were during the course of the game, one followed it, some or all occurred when passions were raised. But the relative bans and extent of the carnival of outrage are interesting and, on the face of it, they don’t make much sense.
Todd Kane was suspended for 7 games for calling an opponent “a diving foreign ****” since the language included a reference, whether expressed or implied, to nationality and ethnicity. Is this 70% as bad as Kudela’s insult?
I am no expert in jurisprudence, thank God. But it seems to me the justification for sanctioning words more than kicks and boots would be that injuring an opponent during the game is a normal byproduct of the game; and even if it is bad, it is commonly understood to be bad. The standard ban for violent conduct (ie “excessive force or brutality”) is 3 games.
On the other hand attitudes to racism are changing, and racism is still not unacceptable to a lot of people. Therefore comparatively stiffer sanctions are required to both show that the governing body is serious about the topic, and to force a change of behaviour.
The problem, as I see it, is the apparent arbitrariness of bans. And once you’ve achieved a change in norms, how do you bring it back to a punishment that's propotional to the severity of the crime without being accused of going soft on racism? That is not something I expect the football authorities to manage well. [Post edited 21 Jun 2021 13:13]
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| Todd Kane and Brentford on 13:14 - Jun 21 with 2604 views | Snipper |
| Todd Kane and Brentford on 12:57 - Jun 21 by danehoop |
Not sure if this is someone being ironic, in pointing that being offended doesn't make them right, when they clearly seem to be offended. Not sure either about the advisability either of using Ricky Gervais quotes is necessarily a massive reinforcement of an opinion.
Hey Ho, everyone has an opinion and so on.
Cant help but think this thread is about to be closed down before too long |
Whether you like Ricky Gervais or not, he’s entitled to an opinion, and I happen to agree with his quote. | | | |
| Todd Kane and Brentford on 13:28 - Jun 21 with 2512 views | Maggsinho |
I suspect this is the first thread we've had that takes us from Todd Kane to gender critical theory in just four pages. |  | | |
| Todd Kane and Brentford on 13:35 - Jun 21 with 2452 views | rsonist |
| Todd Kane and Brentford on 12:37 - Jun 21 by BucksRanger |
Todd Kane called a foreign player 'foreign', factually Todd was 100% correct. I have a foreign surname and have also been called 'foreign' from time to time even though I was born in England. Should I be trying to have people arrested or banned from working for that, no I bloody well shouldn't. It's ridiculous. The case for Todd Kane being xenophobic is no way near proved because of one solitary outburst. There is no proof that he is prejudiced against people from other countries which is what xenophobia means, all that outburst tells you is that he was angry at a single foreign individual for a moment in time.
Jesus Christ this country is completely mental these days. You now have permission to all call me a foreign or English bigot for my belief and I won't take umbrage. |
It was also 100% factually correct that Anton Ferdinand is black. |  | | |
| Todd Kane and Brentford on 13:41 - Jun 21 with 2414 views | loftupper |
You only have to head to a high street on a Saturday evening to see the same people taking offense to all manner of things. Men getting offended when women reject their advances, men getting offended when someone pushes in front of them at the bar, men getting offended when someone looks at them funny sometimes resulting in physical violence. Christ, daren't forget to indicate on the road without someone taking offense and screaming and shouting.
F**king 'Cancel Culture' and 'Woke' are words generally uttered by middle aged white men taking offense to something. | | | |
| Todd Kane and Brentford on 13:47 - Jun 21 with 2366 views | MrSheen |
The original tribunal judgement was set aside, but it needs to sit again. She hasn't been reinstated. |  | | |
| Todd Kane and Brentford on 14:19 - Jun 21 with 2242 views | BucksRanger |
Good point rsonist. Never say black, never say foreign. Any more I should know? [Post edited 21 Jun 2021 14:21]
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| Todd Kane and Brentford on 15:17 - Jun 21 with 2149 views | nix |
Just to clarify, I don't think it was about gender but sex. As I understand it, she has no problem with people being whatever gender they like, but her view is that people cannot change sex, and therefore women retain sex-based rights: this might include in the workplace, in certain settings, like domestic violence refuges/prisons etc. |  | | |
| Todd Kane and Brentford on 16:39 - Jun 21 with 2011 views | denhamhoop2 |
| Todd Kane and Brentford on 10:47 - Jun 21 by daveB |
Oh yeah not suggesting we keep him but do think other players would have been forgiven for those quotes about Kakay. |
By the fans yep not sure Warbs would be so forgiving Respect is a very big thing in what he looks for in a player and his character. | | | |
| Todd Kane and Brentford on 16:56 - Jun 21 with 1949 views | denhamhoop2 |
| Todd Kane and Brentford on 13:35 - Jun 21 by rsonist |
It was also 100% factually correct that Anton Ferdinand is black. |
Not really he is mixed race | | | |
| Todd Kane and Brentford on 18:37 - Jun 21 with 1814 views | Dixie_CT |
Bias and the recognition of difference is a part of the human psyche so trying to police it will always be subjective.
QPR are no different from all businesses and have staff and customers that have view that will be deemed unacceptable and/or extreme. What are you gonna do?
IMO, Kane is in the wrong but the punishment given is disproportionate to the offence and not in line with similar cases.
Kane comes across poorly (fingers in ears, Kakay comments, Canos case) and I don’t really enjoy him being part of the club. Much like I don’t like the fact we are supported by Gove, Copeland, Jihadi John. What are ya gonna do? |  | | |
| Todd Kane and Brentford on 19:32 - Jun 21 with 1683 views | LazyFan |
| Todd Kane and Brentford on 13:07 - Jun 21 by Snipper |
I’ve voted Labour since I’ve been old enough to vote, but in my opinion, Jeremy Corbyn was the worst thing to happen to Labour. It allowed Momentum and o get a foothold in the Labour Party, and they took it backwards.
I work for London Underground, and I’ve been a member of the RMT for nearly 29 years. I’ve seen first hand what happens to people when they dare speak out against the lefts narrative. You’re called a racist, xenophobe, misogynist etc etc………
I honestly don’t know how you think it’s down to Daily Mail readers. [Post edited 21 Jun 2021 13:10]
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Fascinating you blame this on Corbyn.
It was Kinnock and then the Blairites who followed whowere cancelling out the left literally in the party for decades before any poor little ah didhams felt they were politically wronged!
It was Blair who brought in the ideology of political correctness or did you forget all about that?
Remember the term "the PC Brigade"?
Yet somehow it's Corbyn who somehow gets the blame for wokeness and cancel culture.
Corbyn who is not the smarming slick consultancy types of Blair or Cameron, who rides a bike years before Boris stepped away from his limo ("get on your Bike" Lord Tebbit said), who makes homemade British jam from his self-tendered British allotment so, sorta doing British things, yet he's the woke one?
This is the part where you claim your RMT membership gives your left creds, but I suspect your one of those Blairites who would prefer to see the Labour Party become the Liberal Party just like Mandy does, as he voted for them.
Let's be clear, Labour is supposed to be a socialist party, not a libtard capitalist party but a socialist one. Now if the membership vote for Libtardness then fair enough, but its clear the members, not the PLP sellouts, want a socialist party.
But if you want it to be smashy and nicey capitalist party, then guess who is the woke politically correct libtard now? |  |
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| Todd Kane and Brentford on 20:25 - Jun 21 with 1581 views | Stainrod |
The very fact that some fans are trying to semi-defend Kayne or play down his offence explains precisely why he got a long ban - because a significant number of fans and it, it seems, players simply don't get that you can't be racist any more. Not because you will get in trouble for it - but because it is wrong. | | | |
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