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Gentrification 14:29 - Jan 2 with 6455 viewsBazzaInTheLoft

And the erosion of working class culture. I used to pop in here when I worked on Bollo Lane. Quite a few R's were regulars here too.

No irony that this article is written in the Guardian:

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2019/dec/31/loss-working-mens-club-disaster-
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Gentrification on 14:39 - Jan 2 with 4047 viewssmegma

I used to drink in there from about 1982 -88 when I played for a football team from Hammersmith. Our manager was a member and they used to lay on free hot food for us at Sunday lunchtime.
Absolutely scandalous.
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Gentrification on 14:48 - Jan 2 with 4000 viewsBoston

Well Baz, let’s face it, if the like of you and me had stuck around and used establishments such as these, they’d still be around.

Poll: Thank God The Seaons Over.

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Gentrification on 14:52 - Jan 2 with 3993 viewsBazzaInTheLoft

Gentrification on 14:48 - Jan 2 by Boston

Well Baz, let’s face it, if the like of you and me had stuck around and used establishments such as these, they’d still be around.


I’d love to live in London still, but sadly I haven’t got £2m in my sky rocket.
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Gentrification on 14:54 - Jan 2 with 3982 viewsplasmahoop

Really poor by the council. Should be finding an alternative venue at the very least
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Gentrification on 15:07 - Jan 2 with 3931 viewsBucksRanger

Massively Labour controlled council too. No reason they couldn't have found a decent space to continue the working men's club if they cared about such things.
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Gentrification on 15:14 - Jan 2 with 3908 viewsplasmahoop

Gentrification on 15:07 - Jan 2 by BucksRanger

Massively Labour controlled council too. No reason they couldn't have found a decent space to continue the working men's club if they cared about such things.


Well they don't do they. Gordon brown put up beer tax in every budget, then Alastair darling hit pubs and clubs even more. They changed the drinking culture away from pubs. Socialists don't like working class people enjoying themselves. It's all about state control
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Gentrification on 15:45 - Jan 2 with 3803 viewsBazzaInTheLoft

Gentrification on 15:14 - Jan 2 by plasmahoop

Well they don't do they. Gordon brown put up beer tax in every budget, then Alastair darling hit pubs and clubs even more. They changed the drinking culture away from pubs. Socialists don't like working class people enjoying themselves. It's all about state control


I’m a socialist and I literally posted this here.

That place was used by the WI and Somalian communities too. Hardly partying pissheads are they. The loss of this club is a loss to lots of people outside drinkers that have all fled to Wetherspoons for the cheaper pint.
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Gentrification on 16:01 - Jan 2 with 3744 viewspaulparker

Pubs are nothing more than glorified restaurants charging five pound a pint where families let their snotty nosed brats run around these days , such a shame as it was a real hub for working class or dodgy people I was trying to explain to my eldest that the pub was Once a place you could purchase dodgy goods, that eating in them consisted of a manky cheese sarnie on the counter or picking the kp nuts off the page 3 calendar and you had to sup up by 2.30 in the afternoon
A lock was a right of passage
Sad

And Bowles is onside, Swinburne has come rushing out of his goal , what can Bowles do here , onto the left foot no, on to the right foot That’s there that’s two, and that’s Bowles Brian Moore

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Gentrification on 16:28 - Jan 2 with 3628 viewsTonto

Gentrification on 16:01 - Jan 2 by paulparker

Pubs are nothing more than glorified restaurants charging five pound a pint where families let their snotty nosed brats run around these days , such a shame as it was a real hub for working class or dodgy people I was trying to explain to my eldest that the pub was Once a place you could purchase dodgy goods, that eating in them consisted of a manky cheese sarnie on the counter or picking the kp nuts off the page 3 calendar and you had to sup up by 2.30 in the afternoon
A lock was a right of passage
Sad


oh yeah - really sad. you definitely sold that vision to me...

Why stop now, just when I'm hating it
Poll: Is it essential that QPR stay in the Borough of H&F?

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Gentrification on 16:29 - Jan 2 with 3622 viewsplasmahoop

Gentrification on 15:45 - Jan 2 by BazzaInTheLoft

I’m a socialist and I literally posted this here.

That place was used by the WI and Somalian communities too. Hardly partying pissheads are they. The loss of this club is a loss to lots of people outside drinkers that have all fled to Wetherspoons for the cheaper pint.


I accept that you clearly do. I was over generalising. But the Labour party's record in government towards pubs was terrible. Maybe moving forward the Labour Party could champion pubs. May help them to reconnect with some working class communities again
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Gentrification on 17:55 - Jan 2 with 3443 viewsBazzaInTheLoft

Gentrification on 16:29 - Jan 2 by plasmahoop

I accept that you clearly do. I was over generalising. But the Labour party's record in government towards pubs was terrible. Maybe moving forward the Labour Party could champion pubs. May help them to reconnect with some working class communities again


From the 2019 Manifesto:

Labour would:

List pubs as Assets of Community Value so community groups could buy local pubs under threat of closing.
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Gentrification on 18:04 - Jan 2 with 3418 viewsDavieQPR

I would say about 70% of the people that use the club I go to are retired. It is a meeting place for them all. There are quite a few widows and widowers that would have no contact with the outside world if we were to close. They provide a service to the community and are not just drinking places.
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Gentrification on 18:07 - Jan 2 with 3407 viewsJuzzie

Gentrification on 17:55 - Jan 2 by BazzaInTheLoft

From the 2019 Manifesto:

Labour would:

List pubs as Assets of Community Value so community groups could buy local pubs under threat of closing.


It's the 2nd of January. Please let's not have another political argument thread so early in the year.
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Gentrification on 18:08 - Jan 2 with 3392 views2Thomas2Bowles

Gentrification on 18:04 - Jan 2 by DavieQPR

I would say about 70% of the people that use the club I go to are retired. It is a meeting place for them all. There are quite a few widows and widowers that would have no contact with the outside world if we were to close. They provide a service to the community and are not just drinking places.


Bazz doesn't like old people that all voted Tory so you would think him happy to see these places go.

When willl this CV nightmare end
Poll: What will the result of the GE be

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Gentrification on 18:10 - Jan 2 with 3398 viewsGroveR

Gentrification on 17:55 - Jan 2 by BazzaInTheLoft

From the 2019 Manifesto:

Labour would:

List pubs as Assets of Community Value so community groups could buy local pubs under threat of closing.


The ACV listing is little more than a speed bump to a determined developer and planning department.

It did fùck all good for the Goldsmiths Arms anyway.

https://mobile.twitter.com/hashtag/savethegoldsmiths
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Gentrification on 18:21 - Jan 2 with 3361 viewsClive_Anderson

Gentrification on 18:08 - Jan 2 by 2Thomas2Bowles

Bazz doesn't like old people that all voted Tory so you would think him happy to see these places go.


Probably wants them all in one place so they can be rounded up easier come the revolution.
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Gentrification on 18:25 - Jan 2 with 3350 viewsCiderwithRsie

Gentrification on 17:55 - Jan 2 by BazzaInTheLoft

From the 2019 Manifesto:

Labour would:

List pubs as Assets of Community Value so community groups could buy local pubs under threat of closing.


I don't want to get into yet another political debate, and for the record I don't support either Labour or the Tories, but the reason old fashioned boozers close down is because they don't make money.

Either you believe in the free market or you don't. If you don't, join the Labour Party and campaign for state owned grotty pubs or something, but if you support free enterprise and capitalism then don't whinge about the bloody council when businesses you like go out of business or change to something more profitable, because that is literally what free enterprise means.

(Not aimed at you Baz, but riffing on your post.)
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Gentrification on 18:43 - Jan 2 with 3299 viewsplasmahoop

Gentrification on 18:25 - Jan 2 by CiderwithRsie

I don't want to get into yet another political debate, and for the record I don't support either Labour or the Tories, but the reason old fashioned boozers close down is because they don't make money.

Either you believe in the free market or you don't. If you don't, join the Labour Party and campaign for state owned grotty pubs or something, but if you support free enterprise and capitalism then don't whinge about the bloody council when businesses you like go out of business or change to something more profitable, because that is literally what free enterprise means.

(Not aimed at you Baz, but riffing on your post.)


They are not helped though by high levels of beer tax, and huge business rates. So its not a very free market, if its totally stacked against them. Its a question of balance, as with most things. If its totally left to the market with no regulation we may as well let everything in London get turned into flats
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Gentrification on 18:46 - Jan 2 with 3279 viewscolinallcars

Gentrification on 16:01 - Jan 2 by paulparker

Pubs are nothing more than glorified restaurants charging five pound a pint where families let their snotty nosed brats run around these days , such a shame as it was a real hub for working class or dodgy people I was trying to explain to my eldest that the pub was Once a place you could purchase dodgy goods, that eating in them consisted of a manky cheese sarnie on the counter or picking the kp nuts off the page 3 calendar and you had to sup up by 2.30 in the afternoon
A lock was a right of passage
Sad


Too right. I remember some pubs where it was considered effeminate to sit down. Some people say it's only the crap pubs that have closed over the years bit I can think of some good 'uns that have gone as well.
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Gentrification on 18:47 - Jan 2 with 3272 viewsqprd

Gentrification on 18:43 - Jan 2 by plasmahoop

They are not helped though by high levels of beer tax, and huge business rates. So its not a very free market, if its totally stacked against them. Its a question of balance, as with most things. If its totally left to the market with no regulation we may as well let everything in London get turned into flats


interesting article on the topic from a few years ago

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.economist.com/britain/2017/08/24/why-londons-
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Gentrification on 19:07 - Jan 2 with 3208 viewsqprxtc

God help us if this was a theatre, coffee shop, art gallery or a high class sex dungeon.

They want the working class culture without the inconvenience of having working class people attached to it. Take it from them, tart it up, call it something fancy and lose all that made it something worth having. Can’t let those working class enjoy themselves and their lives.

All because they are c unts who are so tightly clenched they can break rocks in their anal canal.

They want what we have have so badly but when they nick it they have no idea what to do beyond f uck it up. Not a creative brain cell amongst them.

Working class are demonised and we are made to hate ourselves but we have a way of life that they can’t stand.

Money is all they know but that is not a creative or joyous mind and when they see people with so little of what they have living a full, happy and creative life, they come in and destroy. It’s not making them money.

Piece by piece, working class culture has been destroyed. Either because it’s perceived as a threat to society or because they have no fulfilment of their own.

All we’ll have left is Premier Inns, Tesco Metros, Coffee Shops and unaffordable flats with a service charge that’ll make you work seven days a week to try to pay.

I’m going down the pub.
[Post edited 2 Jan 2020 19:11]
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Gentrification on 19:16 - Jan 2 with 3179 viewspaulparker

Gentrification on 19:07 - Jan 2 by qprxtc

God help us if this was a theatre, coffee shop, art gallery or a high class sex dungeon.

They want the working class culture without the inconvenience of having working class people attached to it. Take it from them, tart it up, call it something fancy and lose all that made it something worth having. Can’t let those working class enjoy themselves and their lives.

All because they are c unts who are so tightly clenched they can break rocks in their anal canal.

They want what we have have so badly but when they nick it they have no idea what to do beyond f uck it up. Not a creative brain cell amongst them.

Working class are demonised and we are made to hate ourselves but we have a way of life that they can’t stand.

Money is all they know but that is not a creative or joyous mind and when they see people with so little of what they have living a full, happy and creative life, they come in and destroy. It’s not making them money.

Piece by piece, working class culture has been destroyed. Either because it’s perceived as a threat to society or because they have no fulfilment of their own.

All we’ll have left is Premier Inns, Tesco Metros, Coffee Shops and unaffordable flats with a service charge that’ll make you work seven days a week to try to pay.

I’m going down the pub.
[Post edited 2 Jan 2020 19:11]


Great post xtc !!!!!!

And Bowles is onside, Swinburne has come rushing out of his goal , what can Bowles do here , onto the left foot no, on to the right foot That’s there that’s two, and that’s Bowles Brian Moore

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Gentrification on 19:40 - Jan 2 with 3124 views2Thomas2Bowles

Workingman's cafe in a sea of Gentrification in Bermondsey street



Full English with tea/coffee £6.90

Be lucky to get a sandwich anywhere else there for that.

When willl this CV nightmare end
Poll: What will the result of the GE be

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Gentrification on 19:46 - Jan 2 with 3107 viewsKonk

Gentrification on 16:01 - Jan 2 by paulparker

Pubs are nothing more than glorified restaurants charging five pound a pint where families let their snotty nosed brats run around these days , such a shame as it was a real hub for working class or dodgy people I was trying to explain to my eldest that the pub was Once a place you could purchase dodgy goods, that eating in them consisted of a manky cheese sarnie on the counter or picking the kp nuts off the page 3 calendar and you had to sup up by 2.30 in the afternoon
A lock was a right of passage
Sad


I love pubs and think they're incredibly important social spaces in our country, but in my opinion, the pubs that we still have are often much nicer places to spend time than they used to be. Opening hours are miles better, most pubs sell a wider range of drinks, often in better condition, you can get a decent pork pie/sausage roll or bit of dinner in loads of pubs now, and there generally seems to be an effort to keep toilets clean. On the downside, drink is often so expensive that it seems that going to the pub has become a bit of a treat for either young'uns or the elderly, whereas that didn't seem to be the case when I was younger.

Where I live there are 15+ places to go for a pint within a 10-15 minutes walk. 7-8 of those are fairly gentrified, 3 are absolute sh itpits that I would sooner drink in the park than revisit, 2 are boring chain pubs and 3 are good old fashioned neighbourhood pubs where the drinks are on the cheap side and as a result, you get a real cross-section of locals drinking in them. If I'm just going for beer/food, I tend to go to the poncier ones as they sell better beers, and if I want the football or cricket, I go to the cosy back street pubs where you get all sorts having a drink. All serve a purpose and hopefully they'll all still be here for years to come.

As for kids in pubs, we probably do £100+ per week on drink and food when we go out with my son. Chatting with various publicans over the years, it's that daytime/early evening trade from families that keeps a lot of pubs going. We always have books, colouring books/pens, top trumps etc out with us and keep our son entertained. Most pubs boot kids out by 7pm, so I'm not sure it's that much of a hardship. It rarely bothered me before I became a parent. I know some people let their kids run amok, but I think most kids are pretty well managed.

Not sure that having thieves knocking-out stolen gear adds much to the general pub atmosphere, but 2 of the grim pubs near us still have people selling stuff nicked from the local ASDA and Sports Direct, so it's still if you're looking for stolen pork chops, razor blades or sports socks.

Fulham FC: It's the taking part that counts

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Gentrification on 21:31 - Jan 2 with 2944 viewsCiderwithRsie

I accidentally caught a programme on Working Men's Clubs on, ahem, Radio 4Extra - fascinating about the origins - working people fed up with brewery owned pubs overcharging and having lousy facilities. Lots started by returning soldiers in 1918 wanting something better for their hardship.

Lots of effort put into providing games and other entertainments you couldn't get in the pub e.g. comedians. Also, that getting in was a bit of privilege, as a lad you probably needed your dad to sign you in for a bit, so you behaved or he'd have a word.

Not sure that spirit is still about really, sad if not.
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