| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 01:07 - Feb 17 with 1741 views | jtuck |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 19:35 - Feb 16 by daveB |
When the ref stopped the game for Burke going down both Johansen and Field were in the refs ear complaining and he told them to shove it, Barbet was closest to it and could tell the fella was actually injured, i wouldn't criticise them for that. Also thought the Johansen one when he went down was a foul, fella won the ball but took a lot of Stef with him.
I do think when teams hit a bad run managers and fans can over think things a bit, I've seen calls for multiple changes since the game ended but for me doesn't matter what 11 you pick it's about the tempo you play at, move the ball quickly and with purpose, get balls into the box quicker and create some pressure. We haven't done that since the Reading and haven't done it enough all season imo |
Tempo, tempo, tempo. We didn't have any last three games. Can't win unless you really want to and play with zest and appetite. Also may be time to mix it up and play more 'smash it forward' channel balls especially when Dykes is up front. |  |
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| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 01:26 - Feb 17 with 1718 views | Damo1962 |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 00:03 - Feb 17 by Wegerles_Stairs |
They did. |
Good. Keep politics out of sport. | | | |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 02:36 - Feb 17 with 1671 views | Benny_the_Ball |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 23:46 - Feb 16 by superhoopdownunder |
Warburton says in this interview if you are playing well you stay in the team - referring to Marshall in goal keeping Dieng out.
However this is not consistent as Luke Amos was playing very well and was dropped.
That is inconsistent and does not send the right message to the players or supporters. |
Spot on. Mixed messages that can be detrimental to team spirit if some players feel that they are not being treated equally to others. |  | | |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 02:44 - Feb 17 with 1669 views | Benny_the_Ball |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 19:35 - Feb 16 by daveB |
When the ref stopped the game for Burke going down both Johansen and Field were in the refs ear complaining and he told them to shove it, Barbet was closest to it and could tell the fella was actually injured, i wouldn't criticise them for that. Also thought the Johansen one when he went down was a foul, fella won the ball but took a lot of Stef with him.
I do think when teams hit a bad run managers and fans can over think things a bit, I've seen calls for multiple changes since the game ended but for me doesn't matter what 11 you pick it's about the tempo you play at, move the ball quickly and with purpose, get balls into the box quicker and create some pressure. We haven't done that since the Reading and haven't done it enough all season imo |
Agree that tempo is key but with QPR looking so sluggish in recent games it may take a change in personnel to resurrect that. Injuries and suspensions will probably force MW's hand anyway with Sanderson coming in for Dickie and possibly McCallum for Wallace. If McCallum isn't match fit then expect to see Uncle at RWB and Moses at LWB.
Central midfield will be interesting. Does MW persist with Johansen and Field or turn to Amos/Hendrick/Dozzell? | | | |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 07:05 - Feb 17 with 1616 views | QPROslo |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 20:39 - Feb 16 by Wegerles_Stairs |
Find it very strange we still haven't addressed the lack of pace in our team which has been an issue since BOS left. Think it would make a huge difference, even to debacles like yesterday. We are so bloody slow to break.
Hopefully someone is doing something about it for next season, whichever division we're in. |
Well we did, we brought in Moses who seems to be appreciated even less than BOS. I think he's all right, his speed and ability to play both sides are very useful, and some good coaching could improve him further even if not quite to the heights BOS could reach. But I agree more pace would be great to have in other positions if we had the Budget. | | | |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 07:11 - Feb 17 with 1605 views | QPROslo |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 20:49 - Feb 16 by Stainrod |
Interesting the enthusiasm is finally waning a little for Sam Field. A few weeks ago on here from some of the eulogies you would think we had found the next Patrick Viera. But on recent showing its very hard to see how he justifies his place: he can't pass nearly as well as Dozell, he hasn't been tackling or showing the desire of Dom Ball, and he certainly can't (or won't - he seems pathologically negative) run forward with the ball like Luke Amos can.
What does he actually contribute at the moment, apart from a general air of exhaustion, excessive caution and five-yard misplaced passes to Johansen, who would move faster if he were perched on a mobility scooter? |
I think Field has been tackling and covering in front of the back 3 like a hero and has been our MOM with Marshall the last couple of games, helped by lack of competition admittedly. | | | |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 07:37 - Feb 17 with 1587 views | Wegerles_Stairs |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 07:05 - Feb 17 by QPROslo |
Well we did, we brought in Moses who seems to be appreciated even less than BOS. I think he's all right, his speed and ability to play both sides are very useful, and some good coaching could improve him further even if not quite to the heights BOS could reach. But I agree more pace would be great to have in other positions if we had the Budget. |
Rectifying our lack of pace should be the number one priority; it would make such a difference.
Yes, Moses is quick. Unfortunately, he's not a very good footballer.
Budget is also not an issue - Boro got Jones from non-league. We need to be looking at promising players further down the pyramid, rather than signing crocks and has-beens. Plenty of value in the lower leagues if you scout properly. | | | |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 07:50 - Feb 17 with 1567 views | GroveR |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 01:26 - Feb 17 by Damo1962 |
Good. Keep politics out of sport. |
Nope, Gove was definitely in the away end. |  | | |
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| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 10:18 - Feb 17 with 1478 views | daveB |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 23:46 - Feb 16 by superhoopdownunder |
Warburton says in this interview if you are playing well you stay in the team - referring to Marshall in goal keeping Dieng out.
However this is not consistent as Luke Amos was playing very well and was dropped.
That is inconsistent and does not send the right message to the players or supporters. |
Amos had a good game against Reading but not sure he was that good in other appearances recently, was poor at Peterbrough the following week and other than hitting the post didn't think he was that good against Swansea either. |  | | |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 10:26 - Feb 17 with 1458 views | Rangersw12 |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 07:37 - Feb 17 by Wegerles_Stairs |
Rectifying our lack of pace should be the number one priority; it would make such a difference.
Yes, Moses is quick. Unfortunately, he's not a very good footballer.
Budget is also not an issue - Boro got Jones from non-league. We need to be looking at promising players further down the pyramid, rather than signing crocks and has-beens. Plenty of value in the lower leagues if you scout properly. |
Problem with scouting from the lower leagues it can take them time to adapt to the Championship.
Give it 10 games and if these lower league players haven't hit the ground running you will get threads moaning that we should sign some experience
End of the day if we win Sat then majority of these "problems" will be forgotten | | | |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 10:42 - Feb 17 with 1437 views | Burnleyhoop |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 02:44 - Feb 17 by Benny_the_Ball |
Agree that tempo is key but with QPR looking so sluggish in recent games it may take a change in personnel to resurrect that. Injuries and suspensions will probably force MW's hand anyway with Sanderson coming in for Dickie and possibly McCallum for Wallace. If McCallum isn't match fit then expect to see Uncle at RWB and Moses at LWB.
Central midfield will be interesting. Does MW persist with Johansen and Field or turn to Amos/Hendrick/Dozzell? |
None of the five midfielders you mention have pace. I see all of them as deep lying midfielders that break up play and move the ball forward for our technical players and strikers.
The issue for me is the wingbacks are no longer providing width or supply into the strikers. Dykes is great in the air but limited on the deck. If we can’t service him from out wide, his contribution becomes minimal.
A possible formation change may help.
Sanderson Dunne Barbet
Odubajo Johansen Field Hendrick
Adomah. Willock. Chair.
Man City often play without a recognised striker as their technical midfield players have plenty of goals in them. They win back possession quickly and continue to put the opposition under pressure.
Chair and Willock are our best technical players and shouldn’t spend most of the game watching the back three achieving massive touch stats. | | | |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 11:17 - Feb 17 with 1381 views | daveB |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 10:42 - Feb 17 by Burnleyhoop |
None of the five midfielders you mention have pace. I see all of them as deep lying midfielders that break up play and move the ball forward for our technical players and strikers.
The issue for me is the wingbacks are no longer providing width or supply into the strikers. Dykes is great in the air but limited on the deck. If we can’t service him from out wide, his contribution becomes minimal.
A possible formation change may help.
Sanderson Dunne Barbet
Odubajo Johansen Field Hendrick
Adomah. Willock. Chair.
Man City often play without a recognised striker as their technical midfield players have plenty of goals in them. They win back possession quickly and continue to put the opposition under pressure.
Chair and Willock are our best technical players and shouldn’t spend most of the game watching the back three achieving massive touch stats. |
Can Hendrick play left wing back? I'm not sure that would work | | | |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 11:30 - Feb 17 with 1360 views | Burnleyhoop |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 11:17 - Feb 17 by daveB |
Can Hendrick play left wing back? I'm not sure that would work |
Not as a wing back. We need four in midfield imo, but our personnel aren’t ideal for this setup. Permutation up for debate. One thing is clear, we need more bodies in midfield servicing the three technically gifted forwards…..constantly. | | | |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 11:35 - Feb 17 with 1351 views | gobbles |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 21:26 - Feb 16 by ParkRoyalR |
Thought Field was best of a bad lot last night, to go with his two or three previous performances where he was also arguably Motm.
'Tackling or showing the desire of Dom Ball' is the pick of the above along with 'very hard to see how he justifies his place'.
Desire was there to see last night for those who actually went to the game, desperately cajoling his teammates in the 2nd Half and a pathologically positive run down the left flank late-on taking on two Millwall players before being cleaned out.
Another to be added to the list of under-appreciated players whose value has considerably increased, much to the distress of a minority of our so-called fans. |
Field is becoming a bit of a Marmite player. He has plenty of attributes, but I believe he doesn't get forward enough or use the ball quickly enough, so just becomes a player who breaks up play. Obviously that's a big asset, but it puts the pressure on others to pick up the slack.
I don't believe it is a coincidence that since he has come in the team in recent weeks, with the exception of Reading, we have created fewer chances and been slower moving forward. Even games like Coventry, where he was very good, we seem to be under pressure a lot in midfield. He also seldom seems to go beyond the halfway line, so we get back to that old problem of playing the ball around in our own half, rather than the opponents' half.
But he's played a handful of games, so it's really hard to judge him one way or the other, but that position at the heart of midfield is crucial to the style we play.
On Tuesday, I thought he was poor, but showed late on when he was clearly told to get up the pitch that he was a more creative player than he generally shows. |  | | |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 12:41 - Feb 17 with 1287 views | daveB |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 11:30 - Feb 17 by Burnleyhoop |
Not as a wing back. We need four in midfield imo, but our personnel aren’t ideal for this setup. Permutation up for debate. One thing is clear, we need more bodies in midfield servicing the three technically gifted forwards…..constantly. |
I think if you play with that many in the middle it all becomes too congested and the team has no width.
I'm possibly alone in this but I don't feel we need to change the system, we just need to play better, the 2 defeats were not due to the system imo we just had 7/8 of the team having off days and you can't afford that. | | | |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 13:28 - Feb 17 with 1237 views | ParkRoyalR |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 11:35 - Feb 17 by gobbles |
Field is becoming a bit of a Marmite player. He has plenty of attributes, but I believe he doesn't get forward enough or use the ball quickly enough, so just becomes a player who breaks up play. Obviously that's a big asset, but it puts the pressure on others to pick up the slack.
I don't believe it is a coincidence that since he has come in the team in recent weeks, with the exception of Reading, we have created fewer chances and been slower moving forward. Even games like Coventry, where he was very good, we seem to be under pressure a lot in midfield. He also seldom seems to go beyond the halfway line, so we get back to that old problem of playing the ball around in our own half, rather than the opponents' half.
But he's played a handful of games, so it's really hard to judge him one way or the other, but that position at the heart of midfield is crucial to the style we play.
On Tuesday, I thought he was poor, but showed late on when he was clearly told to get up the pitch that he was a more creative player than he generally shows. |
Interactive Ratings above gave Field the highest score of our out-field players against Millwall, which was as I saw the game.
I think he's only marmite for those who could'nt see Dom Ball short-comings against top-end championship sides and want to critique Field's every performance.
Like all, he's a player who works best in a balanced midfield, which we hav'nt had with SJ's recent performance levels and there are more obvious reasons imo why we are slower moving the ball forward of late (Barbet & Dickie's positioning and presumably instructions not to take too many risks) and Chair's tendency to take too many touches rather than risk an Eze first time pass. | | | |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 13:53 - Feb 17 with 1195 views | CliveWilsonSaid |
Another one sticking up for Field. I thought he played well to start with breaking up their play and moving the ball on well. He looked a bit frustrated to me with how the game was going after that. |  |
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| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 13:56 - Feb 17 with 1186 views | gobbles |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 13:28 - Feb 17 by ParkRoyalR |
Interactive Ratings above gave Field the highest score of our out-field players against Millwall, which was as I saw the game.
I think he's only marmite for those who could'nt see Dom Ball short-comings against top-end championship sides and want to critique Field's every performance.
Like all, he's a player who works best in a balanced midfield, which we hav'nt had with SJ's recent performance levels and there are more obvious reasons imo why we are slower moving the ball forward of late (Barbet & Dickie's positioning and presumably instructions not to take too many risks) and Chair's tendency to take too many touches rather than risk an Eze first time pass. |
But Field hasn't taken Dom Ball's place in midfield. He has replaced either Amos or Dozzell and the things he has brought in are offset by what he doesn't do and merely saying "it's Johansen or Chair" ignores how the balance has changed. Field tends to play right in front of the back three. So with Field in we are more solid defensively, but we have are slower going forward and there is more pressure on Johansen as the only link man between the defensive players and the attackers. And while people are pasting Johansen, he seldom gets much room to work.
Merely saying on Tuesday that a fan poll voted him best of a sh1t bunch slightly misses the point. | | | |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 14:02 - Feb 17 with 1170 views | R_from_afar |
We do have some pace in Thomas. Frankly, given his lack of effort and reluctance to impose himself on a game, I would prefer to see Thomas given the nod ahead of Gray, probably off the bench.
Thomas is quicker than all our other strikers and, I should imagine, desperate to prove he can cut it. I think things work best when we play with a single striker but if Warbs feels the need to have two, I would choose Thomas ahead of Gray and - given his current lack of form (but not desire, I think he is trying), Charlie.
I am trying to be realistic here, though, I don't think using Thomas is going to be transformational but it does give us something different and gives the opposition a different sort of threat to cope with. |  |
| "Things had started becoming increasingly desperate at Loftus Road but QPR have been handed a massive lifeline and the place has absolutely erupted. it's carnage. It's bedlam. It's 1-1." |
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| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 14:06 - Feb 17 with 1167 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 13:56 - Feb 17 by gobbles |
But Field hasn't taken Dom Ball's place in midfield. He has replaced either Amos or Dozzell and the things he has brought in are offset by what he doesn't do and merely saying "it's Johansen or Chair" ignores how the balance has changed. Field tends to play right in front of the back three. So with Field in we are more solid defensively, but we have are slower going forward and there is more pressure on Johansen as the only link man between the defensive players and the attackers. And while people are pasting Johansen, he seldom gets much room to work.
Merely saying on Tuesday that a fan poll voted him best of a sh1t bunch slightly misses the point. |
Interesting analysis, Gobbles. |  |
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| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 14:23 - Feb 17 with 1120 views | CliveWilsonSaid |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 14:06 - Feb 17 by BrianMcCarthy |
Interesting analysis, Gobbles. |
Yes. I wonder whether we always need 3 at the back with Field in the side. If we do then they really need to offer more going forward. I noticed that Dickie joined the attack towards the end but as Warburton said it was too late by then. | |
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| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 14:31 - Feb 17 with 1105 views | ParkRoyalR |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 13:56 - Feb 17 by gobbles |
But Field hasn't taken Dom Ball's place in midfield. He has replaced either Amos or Dozzell and the things he has brought in are offset by what he doesn't do and merely saying "it's Johansen or Chair" ignores how the balance has changed. Field tends to play right in front of the back three. So with Field in we are more solid defensively, but we have are slower going forward and there is more pressure on Johansen as the only link man between the defensive players and the attackers. And while people are pasting Johansen, he seldom gets much room to work.
Merely saying on Tuesday that a fan poll voted him best of a sh1t bunch slightly misses the point. |
I think Field is a direct replacement for Ball in that CDM role, whereas Ball played directly in front of and very close to the back three, i feel we have benefited from Field's greater mobility and pace all over the pitch.
I think the fact Barbet and Dickie in particular have become a lot more conservative in possession, playing deeper and not travelling with the ball as they were earlier in the season, is the key here and not Field or necessarily Johansen | | | |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 15:27 - Feb 17 with 1033 views | Benny_the_Ball |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 10:42 - Feb 17 by Burnleyhoop |
None of the five midfielders you mention have pace. I see all of them as deep lying midfielders that break up play and move the ball forward for our technical players and strikers.
The issue for me is the wingbacks are no longer providing width or supply into the strikers. Dykes is great in the air but limited on the deck. If we can’t service him from out wide, his contribution becomes minimal.
A possible formation change may help.
Sanderson Dunne Barbet
Odubajo Johansen Field Hendrick
Adomah. Willock. Chair.
Man City often play without a recognised striker as their technical midfield players have plenty of goals in them. They win back possession quickly and continue to put the opposition under pressure.
Chair and Willock are our best technical players and shouldn’t spend most of the game watching the back three achieving massive touch stats. |
Indeed, and therein lies a key problem. With the midfielders lacking pace the onus is on the wing backs to get forward and Willock and Chair to make things happen in the hole. In recent matches QPR's midfield have played too deep and the gap between midfielders and forwards has become too large. On those rare occasions that Chair and Willock have received the ball, they've been crowded out by opposition players sitting deep and looking to profit on the counter. The wing-backs need to offer more going forward and midfielders need to break the lines to keep in order to the opposition guessing, otherwise they can eliminate QPR's threat by simply nullifying Chair and Willock.
Interesting that having questioned their lack of pace you then go on to stick with Johansen and Field in midfield. [Post edited 17 Feb 2022 15:30]
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| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 16:28 - Feb 17 with 954 views | Dorse |
| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 13:28 - Feb 17 by ParkRoyalR |
Interactive Ratings above gave Field the highest score of our out-field players against Millwall, which was as I saw the game.
I think he's only marmite for those who could'nt see Dom Ball short-comings against top-end championship sides and want to critique Field's every performance.
Like all, he's a player who works best in a balanced midfield, which we hav'nt had with SJ's recent performance levels and there are more obvious reasons imo why we are slower moving the ball forward of late (Barbet & Dickie's positioning and presumably instructions not to take too many risks) and Chair's tendency to take too many touches rather than risk an Eze first time pass. |
Dom Ball? Shortcomings?!
You, Sir, have crossed the line. |  |
| 'What do we want? We don't know! When do we want it? Now!' |
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| QPR's slip continues, soundly beaten at Millwall - Report on 16:30 - Feb 17 with 954 views | ed_83 |
Would be interested to know where this stands on the all-time list of lowest average LFW scores (excluding Marshall) - presume that some of Bosingwa-and-Barton era shitshows would have been lower, but it's been a while since I remember as few as 3 outfield players getting a 5 or higher. Would understand if Clive doesn't want to depress himself even further by running the numbers, though.
I feel like these results and performances have been coming for a while tbh - I know we thrashed Reading but they were dire. A lot of our recent wins have been ground out rather than revelled in, and even when we've played decently our midfield getting over-run has been a consistent theme.
With Adomah getting exposed as a wingback, Wallace crocked, the midfield porous and Dickie, Chair, Johansen and others all out of sorts, is there an argument for switching to a 4-3-3 and getting three bodies in the centre of midfield?
Would mean we can station Field in front of the centre backs, push Amos and Johansen further forward, and use Willock, Adomah or Chair off the wings rather than relying on wingbacks who are either too young or get both the attack and defensive sides of the role right, or too old to cover that much ground three times a week. Something like:
___________Dieng
Odubajo Dunne Barbet McCallum
____________Field
________Amos___Johansen
__Adomah__________Willock / Chair
____________Dykes [Post edited 17 Feb 2022 16:33]
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