| Beth Mead 21:51 - Dec 21 with 15453 views | stowmarketrange |
Well done to Beth Mead on winning the sports personality of the year award tonight.The women’s team won team of the year and the manager won coach of the year too.
It was one of the best days of mine and my daughter’s lives to see them lift the trophy in July,and one we’ll never forget. |  | | |  |
| Beth Mead on 17:22 - Dec 22 with 1884 views | PinnerPaul |
| Beth Mead on 16:22 - Dec 22 by Sakura |
My issue with the womens team winning it is that the standard of football is so low it feels a level of disrespect to the male and female sportsmen playing elite sport.
In 2017 the USA womens team were the World champions they played a match against Dallas fc Under 15’s boys team and lost 5-2
Last year Brazil women’s national team played against Gremio’s Under 16’s and lost 6-0 in a short match
Just doesn’t feel right when we are talking about such a low standard |
We've had this argument before.
I don't get your point - a decent 16 year old male club 'athlete' IS going to beat a top female athlete in almost any athletics discipline you can think of and all the swimming events as well.
Are female athletics and swimming not 'elite sports' then? |  | | |
| Beth Mead on 17:24 - Dec 22 with 1868 views | PinnerPaul |
| Beth Mead on 17:05 - Dec 22 by Northernr |
* every year. With everybody on exactly the side you'd expect.  |
More entertaining than the Keith Stroud threads anyway! 
I feel the same way about them - heaven help us he gets a throw in decision wrong next week!  | | | |
| Beth Mead on 17:27 - Dec 22 with 1862 views | nix |
| Beth Mead on 14:09 - Dec 22 by SheffieldHoop |
Clearly the point is that everyone who pays for the BBC is entitled to criticise it, telling people "Don't watch it then" doesn't solve the problem of them still being legally compelled to pay £159 a year for it. |
FFS there are lots of things I don't want to pay for but have to. Like MPs dovecotes or JRM getting first class travel on the railway. I just don't crowbar it into so much of this forum because there comes a point where it's just really tedious.
The BBC is a public service broadcaster. This is because it is not only there to entertain but also to inform. Anyone who's ever watched some overseas TV will note that it works in keeping the quality and diversity of UK TV overall. I'd also say that it provides a lot of support through local radio and community action to lots of people. It's a shame it's not just subsidised by taxes instead of TV licence as I suspect it would stop a lot of the obsessive moaning.
Anyway Jingle Bells to you. |  | | |
| Beth Mead on 17:33 - Dec 22 with 1842 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| Beth Mead on 17:27 - Dec 22 by nix |
FFS there are lots of things I don't want to pay for but have to. Like MPs dovecotes or JRM getting first class travel on the railway. I just don't crowbar it into so much of this forum because there comes a point where it's just really tedious.
The BBC is a public service broadcaster. This is because it is not only there to entertain but also to inform. Anyone who's ever watched some overseas TV will note that it works in keeping the quality and diversity of UK TV overall. I'd also say that it provides a lot of support through local radio and community action to lots of people. It's a shame it's not just subsidised by taxes instead of TV licence as I suspect it would stop a lot of the obsessive moaning.
Anyway Jingle Bells to you. |
‘FFS there are lots of things I don't want to pay for but have to’
Me justifying my season ticket to the missus every year 😆 |  | | |
| Beth Mead on 17:51 - Dec 22 with 1820 views | PunteR |
| Beth Mead on 15:02 - Dec 22 by R_from_afar |
To hopefully lighten the mood a touch (viewers with narcolepsy are advised to skip this post), here's a story from my youth that talk of snooker brings to mind.
When we were in our 20s, me and three mates I had known since secondary school used to go on lads' holidays together. One summer, we were in Brittany, and on one of the days, we were split on what to do, so two of the group stayed at the hotel, for a beach day, while me and the other bloke went off to visit some chateaux.
When we got back from our tour of the local castles, we discovered the other two were having a drink with two French women we had never seen before. We all chatted to the women for a while, then the women went on their way.
Later, the two who had stayed at the hotel for the day told us how they had used their pidgin French to start chatting to the women, they had all got on well, and that they had even managed to persuade the ladies to have a few games of pool at the hotel. The French ladies had not been familiar with the game, though, and needed to have the rules explained to them, as well as to be shown how to use the cues for best effect.
One of my mates involved in the pool had more confidence in his ability to speak French than his level of competence actually warranted and had tried to tell the girls how to wield the potting implements by translating "Push the cue" into French. He knew "poussez" was "push" but he had no idea what cue was in French, so winged it by assuming the word was the same, at the same time seeking to add some authenticity to this noun that was surely the same in both languages by giving it the wonderfully French pronunciation "que," as "in parce que" - "because" in English. All perfectly reasonably except....
I had a degree in French and fell about laughing when he had finished his story. There is another French word pronounced like that, "queue". It has one meaning in French which is exactly the same as the English word, but I also knew the slang meaning. My mates had been stood at a pool table, trying to help two women they had just met handle two long pieces of cylindrical wood while urging them to "Push the d1ck, push the d1ck!" 
Does that rambling yarn now put me top of the "ignored poster" list?  |
"so you need to hold the dick with two hands , with the tip of the dick gently resting on one hand while you have a firm grip of the bottom of the dick with the other hand....Dont get the wrong ball in a pocket."
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| Occasional providers of half decent House music. |
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| Beth Mead on 17:53 - Dec 22 with 1814 views | PunteR |
| Beth Mead on 16:05 - Dec 22 by Antti_Heinola |
Shall I keep pulling your leg? I'm worried ikt's going to come off in my hand in a minute
Might as well make tiddly winks a sport.
Or tennis. |
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| Occasional providers of half decent House music. |
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| Beth Mead on 18:12 - Dec 22 with 1761 views | Sakura |
| Beth Mead on 17:22 - Dec 22 by PinnerPaul |
We've had this argument before.
I don't get your point - a decent 16 year old male club 'athlete' IS going to beat a top female athlete in almost any athletics discipline you can think of and all the swimming events as well.
Are female athletics and swimming not 'elite sports' then? |
The easiest way too demonstrate how you misunderstand my viewpoint is weight classes in combat sports.
I enjoy watching Tyson Fury fight and I enjoy watching Josh Warrington. I don't care that a really bad heavyweight boxer would beat your most elite featherweight boxer. What I care about is the elite competition between evenly matched people
So a large reason is it comes down to technical level and women's football just isn't there. Especially the goal keepers
Where technical skill is involved I enjoy watching women's Tennis or MMA for example on an equal level to male sport.
Valentina Shevchenko is as technically gifted as any male MMA fighter in the world. The Zhang Weill vs jedrzejczyk 1st fight was an all time classic. Elite sport. Evenly matched I'm all for it. Just don't see that in women's football personally | | | |
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| Beth Mead on 18:33 - Dec 22 with 1730 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| Beth Mead on 18:12 - Dec 22 by Sakura |
The easiest way too demonstrate how you misunderstand my viewpoint is weight classes in combat sports.
I enjoy watching Tyson Fury fight and I enjoy watching Josh Warrington. I don't care that a really bad heavyweight boxer would beat your most elite featherweight boxer. What I care about is the elite competition between evenly matched people
So a large reason is it comes down to technical level and women's football just isn't there. Especially the goal keepers
Where technical skill is involved I enjoy watching women's Tennis or MMA for example on an equal level to male sport.
Valentina Shevchenko is as technically gifted as any male MMA fighter in the world. The Zhang Weill vs jedrzejczyk 1st fight was an all time classic. Elite sport. Evenly matched I'm all for it. Just don't see that in women's football personally |
I don’t buy that woman’s football isn’t technically skilled, but even if I did it’s got fck all to do with the criteria of winning SPOTY.
The criteria:
The Panel will select a shortlist of sportspeople for the main award on the basis of the following criteria:
- Reflects UK sporting achievements on the national and/or international stage;
- Represents the breadth and depth of UK sports; and
- Takes into account 'impact' of the person's sporting achievement beyond the sport in question. | | | |
| Beth Mead on 18:43 - Dec 22 with 1725 views | stowmarketrange |
| Beth Mead on 16:22 - Dec 22 by Sakura |
My issue with the womens team winning it is that the standard of football is so low it feels a level of disrespect to the male and female sportsmen playing elite sport.
In 2017 the USA womens team were the World champions they played a match against Dallas fc Under 15’s boys team and lost 5-2
Last year Brazil women’s national team played against Gremio’s Under 16’s and lost 6-0 in a short match
Just doesn’t feel right when we are talking about such a low standard |
Would you say the same about athletes in previous eras?Should Roger bannister be embarrassed because he could only just run a mile in under 4 minutes?The standard has improved so much that he would be last if he raced today.
Women’s tennis is not as good as mens but because they started playing it in the same tournaments as men years ago.What would you say if they only just introduced womens tennis to Wimbledon and the other big tournaments?Its different to the mens game but not as good,but it’s the best they can be at this time.
If you don’t like it,then don’t watch it,but there were millions of us captivated by the women’s euros in the summer. | | | |
| Beth Mead on 19:13 - Dec 22 with 1678 views | FredManRave |
| Beth Mead on 09:15 - Dec 22 by nix |
The England team are doing amazingly at the moment. Stokes is a fantastic leader, no doubt about it. But some of the conspiracy theories on here, really. I'm pretty sure it's just because the Lionesses caught the public's imagination and appealed to a wider fanbase of people who are likely to vote in a BBC sports personality competition. Less likely to be in the Venn diagram of diehard cricket fans.
Definitely couldn't begrudge the Lionesses their moment of glory. England cricket players far more often get their time in the sun. Seems a bit curmudgeonly to dispute their win and turn it into yet another BBC bashing thread. Aren't people burnt out with this by now? Many of them have moved onto bashing Harry and Meghan.
Personally I think they've achieved a lot and wish them well. If someone else had won, that would have been fine too. |
I've been Meghan bashing for a good few years now. |  |
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| Beth Mead on 19:24 - Dec 22 with 1651 views | PunteR |
| Beth Mead on 19:13 - Dec 22 by FredManRave |
I've been Meghan bashing for a good few years now. |
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| Occasional providers of half decent House music. |
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| Beth Mead on 20:47 - Dec 22 with 1570 views | StreathamRanger |
| Beth Mead on 18:43 - Dec 22 by stowmarketrange |
Would you say the same about athletes in previous eras?Should Roger bannister be embarrassed because he could only just run a mile in under 4 minutes?The standard has improved so much that he would be last if he raced today.
Women’s tennis is not as good as mens but because they started playing it in the same tournaments as men years ago.What would you say if they only just introduced womens tennis to Wimbledon and the other big tournaments?Its different to the mens game but not as good,but it’s the best they can be at this time.
If you don’t like it,then don’t watch it,but there were millions of us captivated by the women’s euros in the summer. |
Thanks to your generosity, it was a day me and my daughter will also never forget. I teach in a primary school and the impact the England women's team have had on boys and girls of all ages has been immense. Fortunately the naysayers are now in the minority. I feel sorry for them that they can't allow themselves to enjoy what was a historic sporting and cultural moment. | | | |
| Beth Mead on 21:55 - Dec 22 with 1485 views | CiderwithRsie |
It's an award show by a TV company, voted by the viewers.
Viewing figures in UK for Women's Final: 17.1m
Viewing figures for T20 final: 3.2m
Group matches in the women football were on terrestrial TV. Group matches in the T20 were only on Sky (and the live matches weren't always at UK viewer friendly times due to being staged in Australia.) Test cricket isn't live on terrestrial TV at all and hasn't been for years except during Covid.
Do I have to draw pictures? | | | |
| Beth Mead on 23:30 - Dec 22 with 1379 views | SydneyRs |
| Beth Mead on 20:47 - Dec 22 by StreathamRanger |
Thanks to your generosity, it was a day me and my daughter will also never forget. I teach in a primary school and the impact the England women's team have had on boys and girls of all ages has been immense. Fortunately the naysayers are now in the minority. I feel sorry for them that they can't allow themselves to enjoy what was a historic sporting and cultural moment. |
You have to wonder how miserable people are that could not see this occasion for what it was. The team was fantastic all through the tournament and to see England win an international football tournament for the first time in my life meant an awful lot to me. I watched the highlights and post game celebrations many times afterwards. The outpouring of emotion in that crowd was obvious and it must have been wonderful to be there. I live in hope that the men can do something similar one day.
It does make me laugh that the same people who deride women's football because a men's team would beat them don't mind spending their time and money going to lower division/championship football matches rather than the premiership. Why are they doing this if only the highest quality levels of sport are worth watching?
The misogyny to an extent here and very much on twitter around this is depressing. The viewing figures quoted before for the final say it all. It captured the public in a way that cricket simply just doesn't outside the Indian sub continent and Australia.
And of course we've awoken the copy and paste "defund the lefty BBC" mob (just as many lefties are convinced the BBC is right wing btw, meaning they've probably got it about right), a popular social media copy/paste item along with "MSM". "freedom of speech", obsession with poppies etc, etc, etc. As already mentioned, just look overseas for how bad TV is without something like the BBC.
Australia has the ABC which is similar and it too is constantly under attack from right wingers and our version of the conservative party. The alternative commercial channels are largely absolute drivel so it would be a huge loss to lose the ABC which, along with SBS, is the only credible TV news source here.
For what its worth, I'm very impressed with recent cricket performances by England and long may it continue. WIn the Ashes and the award is probably theirs next time. | | | |
| Beth Mead on 00:06 - Dec 23 with 1357 views | SydneyRs |
| Beth Mead on 16:22 - Dec 22 by Sakura |
My issue with the womens team winning it is that the standard of football is so low it feels a level of disrespect to the male and female sportsmen playing elite sport.
In 2017 the USA womens team were the World champions they played a match against Dallas fc Under 15’s boys team and lost 5-2
Last year Brazil women’s national team played against Gremio’s Under 16’s and lost 6-0 in a short match
Just doesn’t feel right when we are talking about such a low standard |
Why do you watch QPR when Man City, Real Madrid etc would spank us and we aren't good enough to play at the top level?
You'd have to be blind not to see how much women's football has improved over the last 20 years and with more girls playing the game and more exposure it will only get better. I'll admit to not having watched a lot of it leading up to the Euros but I was really impressed with the standard. England's first goal in the final was brilliant as an example.
Aussie rules here has started a women's competition in the last couple of years and its clear the standard is nowhere near the men. A bit like where womens football was around 20 years ago. However people want to watch it and it will get more girls playing the game. You can guarantee that 10 years from now the standard will be much higher.
The women's final v Germany was highly competitive and of a good standard. There's more of a gap between the good and not so good teams but that was also the case in men's football until more recently.
Comparing women to men just isn't fair, its a different physical make up so of course men will be faster and stronger. Was it entertaining? Yes. Did it capture the public's imagination? Yes, 17 million watched the final. When did 17 million last watch a cricket match on TV in England, or 80,000 attend a game? | | | |
| Beth Mead on 00:14 - Dec 23 with 1346 views | SydneyRs |
| Beth Mead on 10:08 - Dec 22 by slmrstid |
This post suggests to me an argument then that as much sport as possible should be on free to air view and actually is still how the vast majority of people access live sport still.
Perhaps if cricket was free to air instead of being tucked away behind a Sky Sports Paywall the achievement would have been in the public consciousness much more and voted accordingly. Same goes for golf. |
Even when cricket was on free to air TV in the UK it was never hugely popular. Its not a sport that everyone relates to, doesn't provide instant entertainment and requires quite a large time commitment. Even here in Australia where its widely loved (much more of a working class person's game here) test cricket tends to be on the TV in the background most of the time rather than being avidly watched. | | | |
| Beth Mead on 01:55 - Dec 23 with 1295 views | CLAREMAN1995 |
| Beth Mead on 12:24 - Dec 22 by nix |
The thing is Ted the millions of people actually watching the show disagree with you, so why do you want to stop something that other people enjoy, just cos you don't.
It's like me saying why do they have Game of Thrones, I can't stand these mystical sex-and-violence shows, don't see the point of it. I'd never watch the show but can understand that other people enjoy it.
Multiple times more people watch SPOTY than Premier League games on Sky, so there is an audience. Just cos the Daily Express or the Mirror write lazy articles saying people turned off the show based on a comment on Twitter from Dave from Doncaster saying he can't stand that Gaby Logan bird doesn't mean that they're representative of all viewers.
It's like the people on here that regularly come on to say they're giving up on QPR. Why bother to post then on a QPR forum. Just go, already. If people don't like the BBC just don't watch it, simples. Don't get why they have to get everyone else on board. |
I know you watched Lord Of The Rings with Viggo saving the day Nicole and Game Of Thrones is just a little bit more sex and voilence its very enjoyable haha.
Fair play to England , Beth Meade and our own Chloe Kelly .
I think Matt Fitzpatrick should have been on that list winning the US Open first time an English player won in 50 years |  | | |
| Beth Mead on 03:41 - Dec 23 with 1257 views | gobbles |
| Beth Mead on 00:14 - Dec 23 by SydneyRs |
Even when cricket was on free to air TV in the UK it was never hugely popular. Its not a sport that everyone relates to, doesn't provide instant entertainment and requires quite a large time commitment. Even here in Australia where its widely loved (much more of a working class person's game here) test cricket tends to be on the TV in the background most of the time rather than being avidly watched. |
That's just nonsense. Cricket has a massive following in the UK. Notably England are probably the only Test nation that has a large travelling away support.
And if you look at the home Tests, where lots of fans pack the Wester Terrace at Headingley or the Hollies Stand at Edgbaston, do you really believe those are no working class fans? While playing cricket has been cut back in state schools, the following is a lot less posh than rugby union and even more the case up north. |  | | |
| Beth Mead on 04:45 - Dec 23 with 1218 views | SydneyRs |
| Beth Mead on 03:41 - Dec 23 by gobbles |
That's just nonsense. Cricket has a massive following in the UK. Notably England are probably the only Test nation that has a large travelling away support.
And if you look at the home Tests, where lots of fans pack the Wester Terrace at Headingley or the Hollies Stand at Edgbaston, do you really believe those are no working class fans? While playing cricket has been cut back in state schools, the following is a lot less posh than rugby union and even more the case up north. |
Edgbaston and Headingley are great grounds atmosphere wise, but why is there no demand for bigger grounds for cricket? There's nothing better than seeing the Aussies getting pelters in those grounds in a way their much larger home crowds are incapable of doing. Not saying there's no working class fans, but it is much more of a working class person's sport here in Australia. Everyone plays it at school and the players don't sound like they went to Eton (I realise this has changed a bit with England in recent times).
Re travelling support the barmy army has always been impressive, especially here in Australia, although their ranks are swelled here by the large amount of UK expats living here. [Post edited 23 Dec 2022 6:17]
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| Beth Mead on 05:46 - Dec 23 with 1172 views | lightwaterhoop |
| Beth Mead on 20:47 - Dec 22 by StreathamRanger |
Thanks to your generosity, it was a day me and my daughter will also never forget. I teach in a primary school and the impact the England women's team have had on boys and girls of all ages has been immense. Fortunately the naysayers are now in the minority. I feel sorry for them that they can't allow themselves to enjoy what was a historic sporting and cultural moment. |
Wow if there was an award for the most patronising post on LFW this year we have a winner.Thanks for your sympathy. | | | |
| Beth Mead on 07:16 - Dec 23 with 1123 views | daveB |
It's a public popularity vote so although some of you will hate Mrs Browns Boys in some years a lot of people in the country liked it so it won awards.
This year seeing the England womens football team win a trophy was unique, something never seen before so it was popular and hence won much like the England cricket team winning the Ashes in 2005 was a unique event and won lots of awards also in 2019 when they won the world cup. Ben Stokes and Freddie Flintoff won the SPOTY those years, winning s world cup or doing well in the Olympics is usually a guarntee of this award.
It's nothing to do with which sport is better or more elite it's whats popular at the moment and womens football is very popular at the moment although if you don't like it thats is perfectly fine and there is plenty of other sports to enjoy |  | | |
| Beth Mead on 07:33 - Dec 23 with 1087 views | Northernr |
| Beth Mead on 01:55 - Dec 23 by CLAREMAN1995 |
I know you watched Lord Of The Rings with Viggo saving the day Nicole and Game Of Thrones is just a little bit more sex and voilence its very enjoyable haha.
Fair play to England , Beth Meade and our own Chloe Kelly .
I think Matt Fitzpatrick should have been on that list winning the US Open first time an English player won in 50 years |
Yeh I'm home for Christmas and the rents love their golf, they said the same he barely got a mention. |  | | |
| Beth Mead on 08:05 - Dec 23 with 1034 views | PlanetHonneywood |
I found it embarrassing in 2005 that the cricket team got gongs for a series win.
Apparently this included some who had either played in one game and/or filled in as twelfth man ffs! Which begs questions about why aren’t England teams picking up gongs for beating other nations, and how come the Aussies don’t have a separate wing at the Palace to house them every time they beat us?
But even though I was living in the States then, the ‘feel good’ factor was evident from afar. Well it was in England, not sure about the municipalities, but aside of sporting excellence and personality, the feel good factor is what swings it.
And whether some like it or not, the Lionesses brought a massive feel good factor in a really crap year, and which clearly dwarfed whatever the cricket team achieved.
I have no data to back this up, but I rather suspect that a lot of women and girls were as motivated to vote for the Lionesses as many will be to take up football and, as with Emma R last year, that’s huge.
Beth Mead, her team and coach deservedly won their awards at SPOTY. Maybe for those unable to accept it, they should be sporting about it and acknowledge the Lionesses’ achievements as opposed to seeking to marginalise them. |  |
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