| Where’s the progress? 21:07 - May 2 with 14904 views | Jevlar |
Another season done with and another underwhelming season.
Injuries, fitness (thanks Ben), GK choices, and a rigidity to 442.
And I’d also add treating the fanbase with a mild contempt in to that mix.
I wonder when Lee Hoos will stop telling us to be patient?
And Christian Nourry, will go in to a third season (he became CEO in Jan 24 but also there’s that that time auditing our club - what a gravy train that turned out to be!) with hopefully some more pressure from above.
His ChatGPT fueled PowerPoint will be very Emperor’s New Clothes if this time next year we’re 15th again.
25/26 - 15th
24/25 - 15th
23/24 - 18th
22/23 - 20th
21/22 - 11th
20/21 - 9TH! Salad Days
19/20 - 13th
18/19 - 19th
17/18 - 16th
16/17 - 18th
[Post edited 2 May 21:14]
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| Where’s the progress? on 21:23 - May 2 with 10756 views | BushRanger82 |
Nowhere to be seen, I'd say. |  | | |
| Where’s the progress? on 21:52 - May 2 with 10636 views | JamesB1979 |
Well I think there’s been progress more than seasons since Warburton 21/22 season. We were challenging for around playoffs deeper into the season and were mathematically safe earlier. I don’t think we should read too much into results after we were safe. We won last game of the season last 2 years in meaningless games.
It’s a big summer ahead. We have to sort out the injury and fitness issue, otherwise we will not progress next season.
We need to sort out the goalkeeper, get a left back and at least 2 central midfielders. But we also need to make some sales.
I do agree if we’re 15th again next season, then Nourry should go too. |  | | |
| Where’s the progress? on 22:46 - May 2 with 10550 views | Jevlar |
| Where’s the progress? on 21:52 - May 2 by JamesB1979 |
Well I think there’s been progress more than seasons since Warburton 21/22 season. We were challenging for around playoffs deeper into the season and were mathematically safe earlier. I don’t think we should read too much into results after we were safe. We won last game of the season last 2 years in meaningless games.
It’s a big summer ahead. We have to sort out the injury and fitness issue, otherwise we will not progress next season.
We need to sort out the goalkeeper, get a left back and at least 2 central midfielders. But we also need to make some sales.
I do agree if we’re 15th again next season, then Nourry should go too. |
I think this is a fair assessment but I actually have an issue with us binning off the last few games. It’s a standards thing, same could be said for our approach to cup competitions.
We could’ve finished in the top half but haven’t, that speaks to a level of professionalism that could be improved upon. The players are a good bunch of lads, no doubt, but isn’t it a bit depressing that as fans we all expect an early cup competition and for us to be on the beach.
We need to set our stall out a bit higher rather than looking to boost stats and metrics about young players on the bench, sure play 1/2 but it feels like massaging future stats for Nourry and Williams. | | | |
| Where’s the progress? on 23:32 - May 2 with 10449 views | kensalriser |
Progress is being made.
Our average position over the last ten seasons was 15.5 last season.
This season it's 15.4. |  |
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| Where’s the progress? on 23:33 - May 2 with 10445 views | Jevlar |
| Where’s the progress? on 23:32 - May 2 by kensalriser |
Progress is being made.
Our average position over the last ten seasons was 15.5 last season.
This season it's 15.4. |
This kind of detail I can get on board with!!😆 | | | |
| Where’s the progress? on 10:19 - May 3 with 10128 views | derbyhoop |
Finishing 15th with 2 more points than last season does not smack of progress. In terms of goals conceded we've gone backwards.
However, there's a number of players who have had their first season at Championship level and are young enough to improve some more.
Given our limited capacity and inability to bring in significant off field revenues, the drive to be a development club is a step in the right direction. We really need to sell a player for big money, most years, to be sustainable.
That said, we will have to recruit well over the Summer. We are set to.lose Cook and Nardi, probably Field as well, which is a fair bit of experience. A gnarly old pro is needed to supplement the likes of Dunne, JCS and Illias.
A significant improvement is needed in availability of key players. That's really hampered us this season and should prompt a root and branch review rather than BS stats that include the Under 16s and the Women
Overall, limited progress and much more to do. |  |
| "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the Earth all one's lifetime." (Mark Twain)
Find me on twitter @derbyhoop and now on Bluesky |
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| Where’s the progress? on 10:27 - May 3 with 10077 views | rbee |
| Where’s the progress? on 23:32 - May 2 by kensalriser |
Progress is being made.
Our average position over the last ten seasons was 15.5 last season.
This season it's 15.4. |
Ah, but how many millions of pounds has been spent on the squad to achieve that 0.1 improvement? Way too much! |  | | |
| Where’s the progress? on 10:28 - May 3 with 10080 views | NorthantsHoop |
We are the Preston North End of the south, competent to a degree, flatter to deceive sometimes and go on losing and winning streaks in an equal measure. Never really going up, never really going down. For years the thing that bugs me is the physical stature of the team, something that Warburton mentioned years back when coming up against Millwall, but this now transposes to most other Championship teams who all seem to have much taller, physical players than us. This was demonstrated perfectly against Derby last week their back line was massive and Eustace shored it up further when we were left with a midget forward line when we went down to 10 men. |  | | |
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| Where’s the progress? on 10:32 - May 3 with 10051 views | bosh67 |
I think a measure of this is that the Ipswich Town squad is valued at £165m and ours is approximately £45m. Stoke's squad by comparison around £75m. So in terms of buying players we can't compete at the highest level in this division. That sort of limits what we can do and how far we can go but it doesn't mean that the mentality, fitness, injury record and ambition can't improve. It feels like the ambition is not to get relegated. |  |
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| Where’s the progress? on 10:42 - May 3 with 9994 views | Hunterhoop |
| Where’s the progress? on 10:32 - May 3 by bosh67 |
I think a measure of this is that the Ipswich Town squad is valued at £165m and ours is approximately £45m. Stoke's squad by comparison around £75m. So in terms of buying players we can't compete at the highest level in this division. That sort of limits what we can do and how far we can go but it doesn't mean that the mentality, fitness, injury record and ambition can't improve. It feels like the ambition is not to get relegated. |
This obviously makes it harder, Bosh. We all know this. It’s not an even playing field in the Championship.
But Luton, Millwall, Coventry, Hull, City, in recent years have finished in the play offs with similar transfer spend and wages. It’s hard, but it’s not impossible.
And the other way of looking at it, is to say we achieved 56 points in the Ainsworth and Cifuentes season with THAT squad. And we’ve spent about £25m since and achieved 58 points. So if we focus on ourselves, is that improvement sufficient? Have the right decisions been made? We have spent an awful lot of money on players (relative to us and prior years), increased the wage bill, increased the club’s annual losses, f*cked off some good club people, and alienated some die hard fans for 2 more points, over the last two years. There better be a significant improvement next season so you could at least argue the ends justify the means, but at present, they are nowhere near.
There needs to be some accountability. |  | | |
| Where’s the progress? on 11:05 - May 3 with 9936 views | paulparker |
| Where’s the progress? on 10:42 - May 3 by Hunterhoop |
This obviously makes it harder, Bosh. We all know this. It’s not an even playing field in the Championship.
But Luton, Millwall, Coventry, Hull, City, in recent years have finished in the play offs with similar transfer spend and wages. It’s hard, but it’s not impossible.
And the other way of looking at it, is to say we achieved 56 points in the Ainsworth and Cifuentes season with THAT squad. And we’ve spent about £25m since and achieved 58 points. So if we focus on ourselves, is that improvement sufficient? Have the right decisions been made? We have spent an awful lot of money on players (relative to us and prior years), increased the wage bill, increased the club’s annual losses, f*cked off some good club people, and alienated some die hard fans for 2 more points, over the last two years. There better be a significant improvement next season so you could at least argue the ends justify the means, but at present, they are nowhere near.
There needs to be some accountability. |
Look at Derby, a couple of years ago they were going bankrupt and heading for league one
They missed the playoffs by a whisker |  |
| And Bowles is onside, Swinburne has come rushing out of his goal , what can Bowles do here , onto the left foot no, on to the right foot
That’s there that’s two, and that’s Bowles
Brian Moore
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| Where’s the progress? on 11:18 - May 3 with 9843 views | Northolt_Rs |
| Where’s the progress? on 10:32 - May 3 by bosh67 |
I think a measure of this is that the Ipswich Town squad is valued at £165m and ours is approximately £45m. Stoke's squad by comparison around £75m. So in terms of buying players we can't compete at the highest level in this division. That sort of limits what we can do and how far we can go but it doesn't mean that the mentality, fitness, injury record and ambition can't improve. It feels like the ambition is not to get relegated. |
The dummies running the club can’t seem to grasp that crawling to 15th or 16th in the Championship each season isn’t likely to generate big sales for our players is it? |  |
| Scooters, Tunes, Trainers and QPR. |
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| Where’s the progress? on 11:47 - May 3 with 9781 views | JamesB1979 |
| Where’s the progress? on 22:46 - May 2 by Jevlar |
I think this is a fair assessment but I actually have an issue with us binning off the last few games. It’s a standards thing, same could be said for our approach to cup competitions.
We could’ve finished in the top half but haven’t, that speaks to a level of professionalism that could be improved upon. The players are a good bunch of lads, no doubt, but isn’t it a bit depressing that as fans we all expect an early cup competition and for us to be on the beach.
We need to set our stall out a bit higher rather than looking to boost stats and metrics about young players on the bench, sure play 1/2 but it feels like massaging future stats for Nourry and Williams. |
I don’t think they’ve “binned off” the games since we were safe, so basically Preston onwards. But I do think the players have been allowed to be a few percent off in terms of attitude and that makes all the difference in that league. Whilst there’s quite a lot I like about JS, I think getting the side up for games and showing some leadership is not a strength of his. How we are so off it after half times is a prime example of it.
I think it’s difficult to really judge given last few games. Last 2 seasons we beat Sunderland and Coventry away on last day. Would we really have won them if both had something to play for like Ipswich?
But as said, big summer ahead to sort out the key issues at the club. | | | |
| Where’s the progress? on 11:59 - May 3 with 9721 views | BAWHoops |
This season has *felt* better than last because we haven't been in any relegation danger.
We've been solidly mid table throughout but eneded up in the same postion as last year when the heavy lifting points wise was done between Novermber and Feb.
It's also the way the fixtures fell. The four losses in the league at the end came against the teams finishing 3rd, 11th, 8th and 1st, whilst our unbeaten run of 5 before that was vs 23rd, 18th, 16th, 14th and 12th.
It goes like that sometimes. Overall we lost the games we should have and won the games we were supposed to (for every loss at home to Blackburn there was a win v Coventry)..
In a very Un-Nourry like way the progress isn't something that can be defined by stats and anything tangible. It's more that we have 2 good strikers, a plethora of useful wingers and 10's, a decent CB pair and our player of the year is our CM. There's not tons to do in the summer, we all know it's 4 players, a Keeper, LB, RB and CM.
So it IS progress, but I also feel when you look at the fact Wrexham, Hull and Derby were competing for the final play off spot (teams we more than competed against and but for silly collapses would've done the double over two of them) it does feel like maybe an oppertunity missed.
Minds should be focused for next season when excuses will wash no more |  |
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| Where’s the progress? on 12:07 - May 3 with 9692 views | stevec |
| Where’s the progress? on 11:47 - May 3 by JamesB1979 |
I don’t think they’ve “binned off” the games since we were safe, so basically Preston onwards. But I do think the players have been allowed to be a few percent off in terms of attitude and that makes all the difference in that league. Whilst there’s quite a lot I like about JS, I think getting the side up for games and showing some leadership is not a strength of his. How we are so off it after half times is a prime example of it.
I think it’s difficult to really judge given last few games. Last 2 seasons we beat Sunderland and Coventry away on last day. Would we really have won them if both had something to play for like Ipswich?
But as said, big summer ahead to sort out the key issues at the club. |
Well this is it.
I’m constantly hearing on here that JS is just a coach, we’ll get coaching then.
A huge part of his job should be motivation, getting these players to perform at 100%, teaching them to win their own individual battles, never letting up whatever the game. I just don’t see this with JS.
We’ve had games where this team has shown they can do this, Coventry and Leicester at home specifically, but you get the feeling that where this happens, it came from player motivation rather than a collective belief instilled in them from their manager.
This team seems a decent genuine bunch of lads just lacking in inspiration and a bit of guidance from experienced players that we are somewhat short of at the moment.
What we don’t need this summer are more inexperienced youngsters. |  | | |
| Where’s the progress? on 12:40 - May 3 with 9612 views | LazyFan |
The progress is in the squad setup.
We have bought two forwards who have both paid off. These players are worth big monies now. Madsen has improved and is our salable asset. Smyth has improved despite his age.
We have also invested in Edwards who I think is an okay Champ CB, but very young. Kolli has improved and is now established as is Vale. Bennie has improved. And yesterday we saw how Smith could improve too.
There are still major problems with LB, Keeper and Midfield (as Varane has regressed and Morgan still developing and Hayden is shot). We also only had one in on loan this season a rarity for Champ clubs.
Our main problem this year was injuries.
Sort those poistions out and have less injuries and we should be top half next season. |  |
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| Where’s the progress? on 12:55 - May 3 with 9567 views | Tonto |
Having 2 strikers we own getting to 10 goals each is definitely progress.
Madsen was progress.
Several sellable assets is progress (all be it there are some players like Celar who have done the opposite).
Being close to the playoffs most of the year and nowhere near relegation is progress.
Totally accept the end of the season was the dampest of damp squibs but we arebetter off now than this time last year. |  |
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| Where’s the progress? on 12:57 - May 3 with 9566 views | Burnleyhoop |
| Where’s the progress? on 10:42 - May 3 by Hunterhoop |
This obviously makes it harder, Bosh. We all know this. It’s not an even playing field in the Championship.
But Luton, Millwall, Coventry, Hull, City, in recent years have finished in the play offs with similar transfer spend and wages. It’s hard, but it’s not impossible.
And the other way of looking at it, is to say we achieved 56 points in the Ainsworth and Cifuentes season with THAT squad. And we’ve spent about £25m since and achieved 58 points. So if we focus on ourselves, is that improvement sufficient? Have the right decisions been made? We have spent an awful lot of money on players (relative to us and prior years), increased the wage bill, increased the club’s annual losses, f*cked off some good club people, and alienated some die hard fans for 2 more points, over the last two years. There better be a significant improvement next season so you could at least argue the ends justify the means, but at present, they are nowhere near.
There needs to be some accountability. |
£20 million of that £25 million has been spent on players keeping the treatment room staff busy.
The squad is without question overloaded with crocks and midgets. Dembele/Poku/Saito should be swapped out for players with physicality and durability. Our soft underbelly has been painfully obvious for years.
There is plenty to work on over the summer, including a review of the plethora of so called performance functions and what actual contribution they have made. | | | |
| Where’s the progress? on 22:38 - May 3 with 9139 views | HammersmithR |
| Where’s the progress? on 12:57 - May 3 by Burnleyhoop |
£20 million of that £25 million has been spent on players keeping the treatment room staff busy.
The squad is without question overloaded with crocks and midgets. Dembele/Poku/Saito should be swapped out for players with physicality and durability. Our soft underbelly has been painfully obvious for years.
There is plenty to work on over the summer, including a review of the plethora of so called performance functions and what actual contribution they have made. |
I think there’s huge work to do on the squad this summer. The basics of player availability and being in better physical shape need to be addressed. It’s incredible the amount of times I watch us and we are constantly outmuscled. We need a stronger spine to the side. Defensively we have been appealing. We need a big and strong keeper who owns his box. We need full backs on either side. We need more quality in midfield. Madsen has done well but Hayden, Varane and Morgan are not going to get us to the next level. The attacking players of Chair, Saito, Dembele and Poku have had very poor seasons. This area needs a big revamp as well. Smyth has done well in parts, but can be incredibly inconsistent at times. Burrell and Kone have done well. Obikwu has been a major disappointment. Injured after signing to replace an injured player. Then we have the regular Kolli drama.
I can’t warm to the manager. Big changes needed with the likes of Nourry, Belk and Williams. Williams has to be moved on. I reckon the board will give Nourry one more season with the ‘project’. Coming 15th/16th again when you see the likes of Millwall doing well just shows how much under performing we seem to accept as a club. Then our apathy towards the cups shows we have little desire to give the fans any sense of enjoyment and dreaming of a cup run. Southampton get to a semi! It’s so frustrating with our club at times. But definitely a huge summer ahead of recruitment. Need some characters and some experience big time. | | | |
| Where’s the progress? on 09:26 - May 5 with 8789 views | TheChef |
Sorry if it got mentioned elsewhere over the weekend, but based on Championship wage bills, isn't 15th for us basically parring the course?
And I appreciate we have spent more on players of late - but that has garnered for us two strikers both scoring over ten goals for the season, and the potential sell on returns as a result of that.
I don't think though that we can move forward without tightening up at the back, so for me that means a new keeper and more solidity in midfield. [Post edited 5 May 9:56]
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| Where’s the progress? on 12:51 - May 5 with 8671 views | ozexile |
| Where’s the progress? on 12:07 - May 3 by stevec |
Well this is it.
I’m constantly hearing on here that JS is just a coach, we’ll get coaching then.
A huge part of his job should be motivation, getting these players to perform at 100%, teaching them to win their own individual battles, never letting up whatever the game. I just don’t see this with JS.
We’ve had games where this team has shown they can do this, Coventry and Leicester at home specifically, but you get the feeling that where this happens, it came from player motivation rather than a collective belief instilled in them from their manager.
This team seems a decent genuine bunch of lads just lacking in inspiration and a bit of guidance from experienced players that we are somewhat short of at the moment.
What we don’t need this summer are more inexperienced youngsters. |
That's how I see it. Some of his post game interviews are a worry. He almost talks like a pundit father than a manager who can actually influence outcomes. | | | |
| Where’s the progress? on 13:59 - May 6 with 8320 views | QuitePossiblyRaving |
Trying to capture all of the possible positives in one place (and deliberately ignoring many fair criticisms):
(1) We were comfortably clear of relegation all season, unlike in many recent seasons.
(2) The average age of the squad is far lower than it has been, and lower than many (all?) other championship teams.
(3) Striker options - Kone and Burrell, both of whom have done 'well enough' in their first seasons and have (IMO) higher ceilings to work towards.
(4) Madsen. Hopefully we've all learnt a lesson there about supporting players who are adapting to a new league and country.
(5) Players who we've not seen enough from this season - lots through injury - who I also think have a higher ceiling. Poku, Edwards, Dembele, Vale & Varane IMO. I also think Mbengue can improve, but not as much as the others listed.
(6) This one is maybe stretching it, but...we've achieved a 'safe' season with a horrific injury record. Surely it can't be as bad next season...? Would be nice to at least have Chair, still our best player IMO, back as an option for most of next season.
I'm sure we could write a similar list of negatives, most notably around injuries, but I'd argue we start this summer in a much stronger position than we did last season. A left back and a GK are hopefully much easier to find than a new striker. | | | |
| Where’s the progress? on 15:00 - May 6 with 8216 views | Match82 |
I just asked Claude AI where it predicted we would finish next year given our progress and it said 14th to 17th. It also said we finished 11th this year, so turns out we actually did make progress after all, which is terrific. |  | | |
| Where’s the progress? on 15:35 - May 6 with 8127 views | PhilmyRs |
It’s a tricky one.
For me, the progress isn’t really about where we finished this season – which is only marginally better than before – it’s more about the position we’re in now, which to me looks quite promising and gives us a platform to kick on next year. On paper, you can see it, but whether the people running things (and working under them) are actually up to delivering is still a big question.
Squad wise though, there are reasons to be positive. If we recruit well and get even a bit more luck with injuries, we should be aiming for top 6 next season.
Up front, Burrell, Kone, Kolli and Obikwu feels miles ahead of Dykes, Armstrong and Kelman – and the fact they’re all at good ages only strengthens that.
At the back, Dunne, Edwards and JCS are, on their day, top defenders at this level. You can see a really solid partnership there, especially with Dunne and Edwards, if they stay fit.
Then you’ve got Chair and Poku – if we can actually get them on the pitch regularly, they could be massive for us. Big “if”, I know, but you’d like to think Chair is past the worst now. If he’d been available more this season, I think we’d have finished comfortably higher. Add in the younger lads who’ve picked up experience (Mbengue included) and they should all kick on again – just look at Madsen as an example of that.
The only real worry for me is the mentality side. It’s been as weak as pi*s for too long. Recruitment can’t just be about ability – we need a few players who’ll raise standards and drive things on. My concern is that doesn’t really fit the model or sell-on focus, so there’s a risk this decent position we’re potentially in just ends up fizzling out again and we end up back in 16th place.
But in answer to the question, the progress is that we're now in a position where we "could" do something special next season. "Could" being the key word. | | | |
| Where’s the progress? on 15:58 - May 6 with 8050 views | wombat |
| Where’s the progress? on 15:35 - May 6 by PhilmyRs |
It’s a tricky one.
For me, the progress isn’t really about where we finished this season – which is only marginally better than before – it’s more about the position we’re in now, which to me looks quite promising and gives us a platform to kick on next year. On paper, you can see it, but whether the people running things (and working under them) are actually up to delivering is still a big question.
Squad wise though, there are reasons to be positive. If we recruit well and get even a bit more luck with injuries, we should be aiming for top 6 next season.
Up front, Burrell, Kone, Kolli and Obikwu feels miles ahead of Dykes, Armstrong and Kelman – and the fact they’re all at good ages only strengthens that.
At the back, Dunne, Edwards and JCS are, on their day, top defenders at this level. You can see a really solid partnership there, especially with Dunne and Edwards, if they stay fit.
Then you’ve got Chair and Poku – if we can actually get them on the pitch regularly, they could be massive for us. Big “if”, I know, but you’d like to think Chair is past the worst now. If he’d been available more this season, I think we’d have finished comfortably higher. Add in the younger lads who’ve picked up experience (Mbengue included) and they should all kick on again – just look at Madsen as an example of that.
The only real worry for me is the mentality side. It’s been as weak as pi*s for too long. Recruitment can’t just be about ability – we need a few players who’ll raise standards and drive things on. My concern is that doesn’t really fit the model or sell-on focus, so there’s a risk this decent position we’re potentially in just ends up fizzling out again and we end up back in 16th place.
But in answer to the question, the progress is that we're now in a position where we "could" do something special next season. "Could" being the key word. |
been lukcy or maybe its unlucky to see every game this season , honeslty have enjoyed maybe 5 of them maybe 6 , football has largley been awful in most games we are beaten in the first 20 mins and no sign of a plan B let alone plan A to start the game . substitutions have been predicable and in some cases not for the good of the team , witnesssed the kids day out at plymouth , prob our most embaressing exit since the vauxhall game for me,and yes we have had plenty to choose from , i like others cant warm to stephan , and esp after his recent 360 about turn when he had prob been dragged into the office by williams and nourry asking what the hell was he saying , even when its prob the most honest he been since he arrived .
with various staff members and paul furlong being told to leave , think the club has lost a lot of what it used to be , the club everyone used to like even if they wasnt supporters . we know have yet more rumours with kolli . do i see ur progressing next season sorry the answer is NO , do i seelong season or more of the same yes , i Dpont trust nourry and his various yes men to do the right thing for the club and not them selves. trouble is as has been said by pthers if it does go pete tong next season the ban accout will be very emoty and we will have the same crocks and midgets stuck at the club on long deals ,
what happens then ? |  |
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